Ensure Khadr's Rights

I don't care if he actually is a terrorist. I'm confident that our country is already equipped to render any kind of justice necessary. He shouldn't be treated any different than any other suspected law breaker. And if there's no evidence, they better leave him alone.

your country is equipped to render any kind of justice necessary? gee, like giving a young socio-pathic woman who helped aid her socio-pathic serial killer husband rape and kill her own little sister, a 10 year prison sentence. wow, you guys are pretty tough up there. i bet she learned her lesson after tasting canadian justice, huh?

>>I don't care if he actually is a terrorist.<<

Nice, and smart too. The reasoning there is probably: Even if he is a terrorist he is just going to attack those bastards.

What do you think our reaction would be if you are so morally bankrupt as to let us be attacked to assert your petty nationalism? Can you even grasp what it would mean for Canada? Judging by your comment probably not. Trust me, you would care then.

Another reason why you are an idiot for not caring is that Canada is on the target list as well. Thousands of Americans being killed might not be enough to get you to “care” but blowing up one of your nuclear power plants might get you to start caring.

Interesting that in their attempt to drag the Russkies into a no win war to support their allies in the Afghanistan government it was the US who initially fanned the flames of radical Islam and were eager to use the money in their black ops budgets to ensure that Muslims fanatics were worked up to an appropriate fever pitch agains the Russkie infidels<br> <blockquote> Have you heard about the Afghan Jihad schoolbook scandal?<br><br> Or perhaps I should say, "Have you heard about the Afghan Jihad schoolbook scandal that's waiting to happen?"<br><br> Because it has been almost unreported in the Western media that the US government shipped, and continues to ship, millions of Islamist textbooks into Afghanistan.<br><br> Only one English-speaking newspaper we could find has investigated this issue: the Washington Post. The story appeared March 23rd. (1)<br><br> Washington Post investigators report that during the past twenty years the US has spent millions of dollars producing fanatical schoolbooks, which were then distributed in Afghanistan.<br><br> "The primers, which were filled with talk of jihad and featured drawings of guns, bullets, soldiers and mines, have served since then [i.e., since the violent destruction of the Afghan secular government in the early 1990s] as the Afghan school system's core curriculum. Even the Taliban used the American-produced books..." -- Washington Post, 23 March 2002 (1)<br> According to the Post the U.S. is now "...wrestling with the unintended consequences of its successful strategy of stirring Islamic fervor to fight communism."<br><br> So the books made up the core curriculum in Afghan schools. And what were the unintended consequences? The Post reports that according to unnamed officials the schoolbooks "steeped a generation in violence."<br><br> How could this result have been unintended? Did they expect that giving fundamentalist schoolbooks to schoolchildren would make them moderate Muslims?</blockquote><br><br> More at: <a href="http://emperors-clothes.com/articles/jared/jihad.htm">The Jihad Schoolbook Scandal</a><br><br> However that being said, if Canada were hit with a terrorist attack I would be inclined to assume it was just as likely to be a false flag operation by the Mossad or CIA as a genuine attack by crazy Muslim fundamentalist.<br><br> Newsflash folks, in the words of Micheal Meacher a former UK environment minister, "<b>This War on Terrorism is Bogus</b>"<br><br> <blockquote> The 9/11 attacks gave the US an ideal pretext to use force to secure its global domination<br><br> Michael Meacher<br> Saturday September 6, 2003<br> The Guardian<br><br> Massive attention has now been given - and rightly so - to the reasons why Britain went to war against Iraq. But far too little attention has focused on why the US went to war, and that throws light on British motives too. The conventional explanation is that after the Twin Towers were hit, retaliation against al-Qaida bases in Afghanistan was a natural first step in launching a global war against terrorism. Then, because Saddam Hussein was alleged by the US and UK governments to retain weapons of mass destruction, the war could be extended to Iraq as well. However this theory does not fit all the facts. The truth may be a great deal murkier.<br><br> We now know that a blueprint for the creation of a global Pax Americana was drawn up for Dick Cheney (now vice-president), Donald Rumsfeld (defence secretary), Paul Wolfowitz (Rumsfeld's deputy), Jeb Bush (George Bush's younger brother) and Lewis Libby (Cheney's chief of staff). The document, entitled Rebuilding America's Defences, was written in September 2000 by the neoconservative think tank, Project for the New American Century (PNAC).<br><br> The plan shows Bush's cabinet intended to take military control of the Gulf region whether or not Saddam Hussein was in power. It says "while the unresolved conflict with Iraq provides the immediate justification, the need for a substantial American force presence in the Gulf transcends the issue of the regime of Saddam Hussein."<br><br> The PNAC blueprint supports an earlier document attributed to Wolfowitz and Libby which said the US must "discourage advanced industrial nations from challenging our leadership or even aspiring to a larger regional or global role". It refers to key allies such as the UK as "the most effective and efficient means of exercising American global leadership". It describes peacekeeping missions as "demanding American political leadership rather than that of the UN". It says "even should Saddam pass from the scene", US bases in Saudi Arabia and Kuwait will remain permanently... as "Iran may well prove as large a threat to US interests as Iraq has". It spotlights China for "regime change", saying "it is time to increase the presence of American forces in SE Asia".<br><br> The document also calls for the creation of "US space forces" to dominate space, and the total control of cyberspace to prevent "enemies" using the internet against the US. It also hints that the US may consider developing biological weapons "that can target specific genotypes may transform biological warfare from the realm of terror to a politically useful tool".<br><br> Finally - written a year before 9/11 - it pinpoints North Korea, Syria and Iran as dangerous regimes, and says their existence justifies the creation of a "worldwide command and control system". This is a blueprint for US world domination. But before it is dismissed as an agenda for rightwing fantasists, it is clear it provides a much better explanation of what actually happened before, during and after 9/11 than the global war on terrorism thesis. This can be seen in several ways.<br><br> First, it is clear the US authorities did little or nothing to pre-empt the events of 9/11. It is known that at least 11 countries provided advance warning to the US of the 9/11 attacks. Two senior Mossad experts were sent to Washington in August 2001 to alert the CIA and FBI to a cell of 200 terrorists said to be preparing a big operation (Daily Telegraph, September 16 2001). The list they provided included the names of four of the 9/11 hijackers, none of whom was arrested.<br> It had been known as early as 1996 that there were plans to hit Washington targets with aeroplanes. Then in 1999 a US national intelligence council report noted that "al-Qaida suicide bombers could crash-land an aircraft packed with high explosives into the Pentagon, the headquarters of the CIA, or the White House".<br><br> Fifteen of the 9/11 hijackers obtained their visas in Saudi Arabia. Michael Springman, the former head of the American visa bureau in Jeddah, has stated that since 1987 the CIA had been illicitly issuing visas to unqualified applicants from the Middle East and bringing them to the US for training in terrorism for the Afghan war in collaboration with Bin Laden (BBC, November 6 2001). It seems this operation continued after the Afghan war for other purposes. It is also reported that five of the hijackers received training at secure US military installations in the 1990s (Newsweek, September 15 2001).</blockquote><br> Remainder of article at:<br> <a href="http://politics.guardian.co.uk/iraq/comment/0,12956,1036687,00.html">This War on Terrorism is Bogus</a><br><br> The use of false flag attacks and strikes to stir up a population for war is the oldest trick in the book and not a tactic confined to Nazis and Commies. And if you think George Bush and his puppet masters would give a tinker's damn about a few thousand American lives in exchange for control of a vital and increasingly contested for resource like oil, especially now that it's becoming clearer that the days of the cheap, plentiful hydrocarbon energy necessary to fuel economic growth are gone with the world oil production likely to hit the final <a href="http://www.energybulletin.net/primer.php">peak</a> sooner rather than later, more fool you.<br><br> Note that there are more and more US citizens who are coming to the same conclusion and not afraid to say so, just check out these threads from today at www.DemocraticUnderground.com <br><br> <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5644180&mesg_id=5644180">Lets reconsider Bush and the official 911 story</a><br><br> <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5648350">Putting it all in perspective --> PNAC 101 - RISE OF THE NEOCONS</a><br><br> As long as the USA continues to poison the earth with their depleted uranium weaopons of mass destruction causing untold death, destruction and misery against friend and supposed "enemies" alike, and as long as our Canadian government goes along with it and cowtows to them and refused to make it an issue, no one need bother come crying the blues to me about the dastardly, evil doing Islamic terrorist and their horrific plans. Like Jesus taught, take the beam out of your own eye before trying to remove the speck from somone elses eye. (Dubya the idiot prince said Jesus was his favourite philosopher, remember?)<br><br> <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=4124449">Depleted Uranium an Introduction</a> by Thomas Fasy MD PhD<br> <blockquote><b>Heads roll at Veterans Administration<br><br><br> Preventive Psychiatry E-Newsletter charged Monday that the reason Veterans Affairs Secretary Anthony Principi stepped down earlier this month was the growing scandal surrounding the use of uranium munitions in the Iraq War.<br><br> Considering the tons of depleted uranium used by the U.S., the Iraq war can truly be called a nuclear war.<br><br> Writing in Preventive Psychiatry E-Newsletter No. 169, Arthur N. Bernklau, executive director of Veterans for Constitutional Law in New York, stated, “The real reason for Mr. Principi’s departure was really never given, however a special report published by eminent scientist Leuren Moret naming depleted uranium as the definitive cause of the ‘Gulf War Syndrome’ has fed a growing scandal about the continued use of uranium munitions by the US Military.”<br><br> Bernklau continued, “This malady (from uranium munitions), that thousands of our military have suffered and died from, has finally been identified as the cause of this sickness, eliminating the guessing. The terrible truth is now being revealed.”<br><br> He added, “Out of the 580,400 soldiers who served in GW1 (the first Gulf War), of them, 11,000 are now dead! By the year 2000, there were 325,000 on Permanent Medical Disability. This astounding number of ‘Disabled Vets’ means that a decade later, 56% of those soldiers who served have some form of permanent medical problems!” The disability rate for the wars of the last century was 5 percent; it was higher, 10 percent, in Viet Nam. </blockquote><br><br> <a href="http://www.sfbayview.com/012605/headsroll012605.shtml">Heads roll at Veterans Administration</a><br><br> Checkout the article as well <a href="http://www.hermes-press.com/brainwash1.htm">Brainwashing America</a> by Dr. Norman Livergood, a former dept. head at the US Army War College.<br>

It's the old adage;what goes around, comes around. The US has been killing civilians all over the world. They disrupted lives of people in foreign countries and yet are appalled when any of them strike back. They are always adverse to any religion or politics that they don't aprove of and attempt to "correct" the situation in their own way. By force if needed or by graft if they want to.
A man has just been released from a German prison for murdering an American diver. The man has served his sentence but none the less, the US government is upset he wasn't extradited to the US to stand trial again. They feel anyone else's justice is not good enough. No matter what justice Khadar faces in Canada, the Americans will still want their's as well (even in addition to).

Boflaade -

Thankyou for providing the essence of Vive in your response. So well thought out. So nuanced. So Canadian.

>>It's the old adage;what goes around, comes around.<<

I have asked you over and over to tell me just what it is we did to have sept 11th come around, just what we did to “earn” it. You have yet to get all 75 of those IQ points of yours going to answer me.
Don’t worry Boflaade, since Canada never does anything, other then ride on our ass like a tick on a dog complaining all the way that they don’t have enough control over where the dog goes, You might just be over looked by the terrorists. They are busy attacking the UK, Australia and the USA as well as any other country with a spine.

You are right on one account, what goes around comes around, which is why you are such a pathetic little loser.

> A man has just been released from a German prison for murdering an American diver.

Yep.

Y'know why? Because it was the German way of obtaining the release of their citizen held hostage by Hamas/Hizbolla/AQ.

Nothing about having "served his sentence".

Nope. Just, ah, screw the Americans, eh?

Typical attidude, I'm sure you agree with.

Only by ensuring people's individual rights and the right to a fair trial, can Canada
(1) maintain the respect for these things that it has built up in the world;
(2) ensure that threats and acts of terrorism do not occur on Canadian soil.

With the recent news about torture and rendition, our neighbour to the south has unfortunately lost the respect of others, particularly European nations, and is doing everything to limit terrorism. Canada should set its own foreigh policy and not be drawn into US foreign policy.

I realize this is a great challenge.

Ignoring the fact that you're not actually quoting any specific case and could be making that entire thing up; what, exactly, does a murder trial have to do with a *suspected* terrorist? I would much rather see the SUSPECT (innocent until proven guilty and all that) go through a fair trial than be sent to Guatanemo without having even had the opportunity to defend himself. The word "justice" was thrown out the window in the USA quite some time ago, about the time that secret spying and torture were instituted as Standard Operating Procedure.

---
Your mantra has been your opinions are stifled due to their contrary nature, when they are actually stifled for being without perceivable foundation.

I agree,
I think Canada is in a very unique position as a middle power to promote real democracy. If we are going to maintain and grow respect internationally we are going to have to stop talking and actually stand up for our democratic beliefs. Canada will earn much respect for our stance on the Iraq war in the future (particularly from the E.U. I would imagine), but we must also uphold our democratic beliefs, and deal with Canadian criminals under Canadian law.

Why yes, many of us here actually believe that justice should be just, rather than twisted to serve the USA's jingoism. Sadly, your own arrogant, insulting response is far too typical of the americans who come and post here.

---
Your mantra has been your opinions are stifled due to their contrary nature, when they are actually stifled for being without perceivable foundation.

makes you an expert on america and american jurisprudence? do you live in the united states or have you travelled widely in it? are you intimately familar with english common law (because that's what the us legal system is based on?)did you read about it somewhere or watch a movie or tv show pretending to be america but actually shot in toronto or vancouver (and produced by ignorant greedy canadians?) who are these millions(!) of legal and ill-legal immigrants soo desperate to reach america's shores every year they're willing to die trying? must be a figment of our collective immagination. your observation(s) are ignorant and pathetic. typical ignorant, smug canadian (i'm assuming you're canadian)who can dish it out, but can't take it. do you think that shit flys outside the (very) narrow confines of canada?

and the paul bernardo/karla homolka debacle reference is called SARCASM. i've been told by otherwise very liberal, thoughtful people that many canadians are just a few seconds short (if you know what i mean,) but c'mon on...

I can’t let this go… again. <br />
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What did thee people do to have this “come around”? <br />
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<a href="http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/World%20Trade%20Center%20censored%20photo%2003.jpg">http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/World%20Trade%20Center%20censored%20photo%2003.jpg</a><br />
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<a href="http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/World%20Trade%20Center%20censored%20photo%2005.jpg">http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/World%20Trade%20Center%20censored%20photo%2005.jpg</a><br />
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<a href="http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/wtc%20jumper%20aftermath.jpg">http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/wtc%20jumper%20aftermath.jpg</a><br />
<br />
That is what happened here. <br />
<br />
What did these people do? <br />
<br />
<a href="http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/people/1543.html">http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/people/1543.html</a><br />
<br />
<a href="http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/people/1546.html">http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/people/1546.html</a><br />
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<a href="http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/people/1561.html">http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/people/1561.html</a><br />
<br />
At 2 and 3 years old they must have done something pretty bad to make getting incinerated in a terrorist attack “come around”.. Right? <br />
<br />
These people were Canadian so they must have been “innocent” yet they were still murdered… Can you explain that? <br />
<br />
<a href="http://www.members.shaw.ca/kcic1/cdnwtc.html">http://www.members.shaw.ca/kcic1/cdnwtc.html</a><br />
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I knew one on the right, she seemed nice enough, what did she do to have this come around? <br />
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<a href="http://www.legacy.com/Sept11.asp?Page=TributeStory&PersonId=101214">http://www.legacy.com/Sept11.asp?Page=TributeStory&PersonId=101214</a><br />
<br />
We are up against monsters who would fill school gyms full of children and set off bombs or blow them selves up at wedding ceremonies or fly airplanes full of frightened horrified people into buildings full of people. <br />
<br />
They do things like this: <br />
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<a href="http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/russian%20officer%20brutal%20execution.asf">http://media.maineindymedia.org/content/uploads/Cyril/saintv/russian%20officer%20brutal%20execution.asf</a><br />
<br />
and this:<br />
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<a href="http://azazel.smugmug.com/photos/18717244-S.jpg">http://azazel.smugmug.com/photos/18717244-S.jpg</a><br />
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<a href="http://static.flickr.com/14/17802591_cc070a4669_m.jpg">http://static.flickr.com/14/17802591_cc070a4669_m.jpg</a><br />
<br />
and this:<br />
<a href="http://www.fugly-bali.org/bombing.html">http://www.fugly-bali.org/bombing.html</a><br />
<br />
And this:<br />
<a href="http://varifrank.com/images/madrid-bombing-large-01.jpg">http://varifrank.com/images/madrid-bombing-large-01.jpg</a><br />
<br />
And this: <br />
<a href="http://www.greatdreams.com/london-bombing.jpg">http://www.greatdreams.com/london-bombing.jpg</a><br />
<br />
<br />
And they do it EVERY DAY, all over the world, to dozens of different countries. 3828 times since Sept 11th 2001 as of this morning. <br />
<br />
But we had it coming… <br />
<br />
May you get what is coming to you boflaade.