European Governments Make Peace With Washington On Abductions, Torture

And the new world order marches on. Jawhol!

Sounds to me like the same old world order given NATO did after all cook up the propaganda justifying the bombing of Serbia and has played a role in an unjust war against Afghanistan. Same old world order responsible for the destruction be it in Chile, Nicaraugua, Guatemala.... add you favourite example of US sponsored terror.

Good thing Canadians live in their own world, eh?

I had been playing with the thought that Canada might do well to join the E.U.

So much for that!

Don't think too deeply. The EU will not succeed. There is virtually no growth in their economy. The US will have a growth this year of 3.8% which means success. Success for the US means the same for us. I will remind you if you are comfortable living in Canada and are pleased with your lot, remember the team that got you there and that kind hearts is the USA. Besides who else would you rather live beside. If we had been unfortunate to live beside France, Germany, and any other number of countries we wouldn't even be here now. Living beside the Yanks means we don't even have any real responsibilities and we go along and be comfortable, safe and secure.

Sorry, but the US could not have what it has if they did not have such a good neighbour in Canada supplying cheap, plentiful resources; a northern neighbour that has been far friendlier and co-operative with the US as opposed to the other way around. Yes, at times there was a sort of team effort which helped Canada`s standard of living, but it was an even deal, and unfortunately, the US power structure no longer see Canada as a partner- only a vassal state to force into compliance. As far as responsibilites, well, Canadians want to assume their own responsibilites without having to worry about what Washington thinks, but again, the US power structure doesn`t want that either, just that Canada should fall under the eagle`s wing and go along with the Washington consensus. And don`t write off the EU just yet. And this 3.8% 'growth' you speak of in the US, well, this doesn`t in any way mean progress for the majority of the US population. There`s more poverty and bankruptcies than ever in the US. It`s the same in Canada- we see more good paying jobs leave the country, but the corporate media continues to spew the garbage about how robust the economy is.

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Dave Ruston

>>a northern neighbour that has been far friendlier and co-operative with the US as opposed to the other way around.<<<

PHULEEEESE…

“Those bastards”, “morons” “Failed Statesmen” Booing our anthem, burning our flags, media personalities and reporters who make their living by exclusively attacking the USA, “Greed was behind 9/11”, It was “payback,” Pee-wee-hockey teams attacked, This Canadian national victim-hood trip, women told to “go the fuck back to the USA”, whines about softwood, BSE, BMD, NORAD, NATO, flood management, the “northwest passage” passports, believing whatever crazy, paranoid, ridiculous myth that comes down the pike if it denigrates those “mericans”, the Artic, daylight savings time, Kyoto, even porcupine caribou! Jeopardizing American security over trade issues or simply in the never ending quest to assert yourselves, this delusional air of smug superiority, cars keyed, endless whining about all things American even as you do the same exact things yourselves or benefit from those actions. I could go on for hours here without even touching the bigotry expressed on the average vivelecanada thread.

We get never ending moralizing and lectures from your vocal know it alls. Your government never misses the opportunity to poke us in the eye, your media trashes us but is mute on the staggering trade surplus you enjoy, or military protection, or unfettered access to the worlds largest economic market… Even the lowbred, pompous braying ass, ill mannered, half witted, shaved gibbon circus monkey that you inflicted on us as ambassador feels the need to build his political “street cred” by tossing out insults.

The Canadians I admire never felt the need to tear someone else down to make themselves feel superior. They are people of quiet dignity that don’t need to constantly measure themselves against their neighbors, instead they work to be the best they can be regardless of what someone else does. They don’t need scapegoats. They are smart enough to see the “us against them” propaganda being pushed by the liberal government and it media for what it is; a cynical way to manipulate the easily lead among you. It is just too bad it works so well.

Although I am Canadian I don't really feel qualified. I don't belittle other people nor hate other folks. To be a national of this country you have to acquire hate. These people should just look at what we have become. Many Canadians don't realize the responsibility the Americans must bear. Canada is called by many outsiders in America and Europe as the moral superiority capital of the world. We have all the fun but none of the responsibility. I agree with the above post and am glad that I can agree with someone around here. Mr. Dithers sucking up to President Clinton for cheap politics will fly well in Ontario. Can you imagine if Mr. Harper met with Mr. Bush.
This is a nice enough place to live but I don't really understand the place. United States is our favourite place to visit and always has been. How can you not like a New Yorker, folks in San Diego, Texans and people in the south. They are always wonderful to meet and they are all different.

What B.S.

If you don't like it here then you are free to leave. No one is keeping you here. There are planes leaving every hour and I am sure you don't live too too far from an airport. Remember Canada is a DEMOCRACY not a DICTATORSHIP so you don't need permission.

Also the U.S. border is within 200 km from most Canadian Cities so you can walk if your health is up to it.

If you want to be an American that bad, from what you have wrote now and in the past, I am sure if you meet their requirements they might let you visit but I am just as sure you don't have any occupational qualifications that some other American can fill other then you, in which case I wish you good luck.

Loyalty is about love not hate, a feeling or attitude of devoted attachment and affection. Which is obvious you don't have.


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Perception is two thirds of what we perceive reality to be.

Difficult decisions are a privilege of rank.

Typical Liberal attitude.

If you don't hate America...you don't deserve to be a Canadian and you should leave. That's Canadian values for you.

This is what my post was all about. Canadians don't even realize they have a problem. I feel sorry for Canadians around this site. Many are in need of therapy. Some I think are quite dangerous.

Anon's post suggests to me that apparently there are still some fascists who are quite sensitive to being identified for what they are. I do wish "American" posters on this site would stop speaking as if all Americans supported the torture club in the White House.

I am a Big C Conservative, have been since before I was able to vote.

Shows how wrong you are to start.

I BELIEVE IN……

That Canadians receive fair and equitable treatment under local and international law whether you are in Canada or any other Country that Canada has diplomatic relations with. That what is expected in one Country by its citizens is received equally in these other Countries by our citizens, no exceptions including the way we operate our businesses with the same opportunities.

That both Countries Canada and the United States of America have a level playing field receiving equally the same rights and protection of basic rights in Business, Trade, Travel and human rights and liberties as citizens of our perspective countries.

I am not interested in bashing members and / or non-members based on their political views, sexual preference, ethnic, cultural, social economical position or purposely posting to incite anger but to post with the sole intent of creating a clean and on-topic intellectual debate.

Which at times is extremely hard to keep to with people like you and your friends!


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Perception is two thirds of what we perceive reality to be.

Difficult decisions are a privilege of rank.

Rice is good at selling her country. Oops! if the true facts come out. There are countries that "have to believe her" as the world opinion will turn against them, if they had these prisons with full knowledge of what Americans use them for. Better to say: "Oh!, but we were deceived". Rice better hope her country will back her and hope no further serious investigation will continue.