1. Why has nobody in the media brought up a similar raid that these same people engineered a little less than three years ago (Aug 23/03), with all the same self-congratulatory back-patting and shouting at that time about stopping a great terrorist plot (remember the panic about the plane flying over the Pickering reactor OHMYGODJUSTTHINK!!!) - but within weeks all the "terrible terrorists" were released with nothing more than some minor visa irregularities actually uncovered (and nary a word on any front page about how or why YOU reported the "terrorist" stories without question, no mea culpas to be found... - and no "investigative" stories about how all that happened - or why)?? How in god's name did they manage to get so far out of touch with reality then to inflate some minor visa problems into a major terrorist plot then? - and what have we learned since to make us think their "work" is any better now (do we remember Juliet O'Neill? Airbus? Vancouver? how many police corruption cases are we dealing with in Toronto at the moment? I've lost track...? Are the Milgard and Trustcott stories working their way through the system? etc and etc and etc????) Why is the entire Canadian media acting like Hill and Knowlton for the RCMP-etc here, rather than the impartial purveyors of "all" the news they are supposed to be?? (remember, again I remind you, stand back from the police announcements and hysteria, which are somewhat less than impartial - there has been no violence, no bombs, no threats, no nothing, only an apparent sting operation of some sort ("Psst hey kid, wanna try this pot? HAHA GOTCHA YOU'RE UNDER ARREST YOU DAMNED POTHEAD!!!" - or the clever undercover lady cops pretending to sell sex then snatching the customers - pathetic!!), and a lot of running around by 400 cops with big guns and flak suits handcuffing a few non-resisting kids, and so far at least completely unproven accusations and allegations, from a very much NON-impartial source) (if it turns out there are no actual terrorists to worry about, then a whole lot of people who like to strut around with guns showing what big men they are and scaring people and sneak around reading other people's mail are suddenly out of work and have to behave themselves, not to mention another gang of people who are hellbent on making everybody carry some form of citizen ID card). I mean, that is to say, these very people have done very similar "The sky is falling!!!!" games before, and wound up with nothing but eggy faces - surely at least a TINY bit of skepticism would not be out of place here??? Why the huge charge of all the media to the "Oh my god!! We almost all died from terrible terrorists!!!" bandwagon? I just don't really get it. Unless, of course, there are ulterior motives about keeping the Canadian people sufficiently worried about their safety to allow various somewhat repressive laws etc - but that would getting into conspiracy theory territory, and we certainly wouldn't want to do that - let's just stick with what we can see....
2. Almost of of those arrested and accused of these terrible things are young people, a lot of them just teenagers, and were "clandestinely observed" (if YOU do this to your neighbor, you're gonna get in trouble!! - what a sick bunch of f***s!) for months, it appears, as they talked about things the police interpreted as "terrorist"-related (as they interpreted the poor Pakistani trying to learn to fly 3 years ago and being instructed by his instructor to pass near the Pickering reactor, and we also have to wonder how much the "police" and everyone led them on, and perhaps, it now appears, even lured them into buying the so-called terrorist bombing materials (and this of course raises the question - what other "undercover officers" inveigled their way into the chat rooms where these kids were hanging around and talking about all sorts of stuff, and encouraged talk of bombing and so on, in order to get these kids to go further than they might have gone without such encouragement????). But what I want to know is - why didn't somebody talk to some parents along the way here, and sit down with some kids (which they are!), and explain to them that the things they were doing or thinking about doing were potentially quite dangerous, and could get them in a lot of trouble and cause a lot of damage to their community and country they probably weren't really considering and probably really didn't want, and if they were having problems or issues or whatever with the way things were, there were, at least, other channels to try first, before resorting to violence which would get them into all sorts of trouble, which could have a lot of bad repercussions for a lot of people around them, that they probably didn't realise? Maybe they were talking to some bad people, and could benefit from a bit of different talk. You know, the intelligent Atticus Finch "treat em like adults" approach, rather than the somewhat less intelligent, but very modern American, "we gonna kick ass and treat em like dogs what oughtta do what they damn well told by god we'll show em!!!" approach? It's pretty obvious to any intelligent person which way engenders at least a chance of mutual understanding and respect and dialogue and a peaceful outcome all the way around - and which ensures increased animosity and violence. Why would the cops choose the path leading to violence - and why would the media support this approach?
3. What possible reason would the "security" forces, whatever they were, have that they deemed it necessary to make such a spectacle out of gathering up their suspects? No "imminent threat". No "clear and present danger" (heh heh - we offered the kid a gun, and he took it - so he might have shot somebody, so we arrested him - we are so clever!!). No known group of armed, experienced criminals ready and willing to engage in some kind of firefight when faced with arrest. None of that - just a bunch of teenagers from mostly good homes, according to all reports, living in the family homes, none armed or with any history of violence (beyond police fantasies) - why not send a couple of normal "peace" officers to the doors of the homes in some normal fashion, and have a chat with the suspected felon, and then if necessary read out charges and rights, and take the accused into custody - normal procedure sort of stuff???? There has been NOTHING in any of the news reports so far to indicate that this approach would not have met with complete success, at least as far as getting the 'suspects" into custody is concerned. It certainly would have raised a lot less attention in the media and thus eyes of the Canadian public, and offered a lot less opportunity for everyone to go around shouting about the "great terrorist plot" that had been foiled. Unless, of course, that indeed was the whole point of the exercise.
4. Final rhetorical question - why will no mainstream Canadian media print this letter, or one like it asking similar questions?
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Dave Patterson
Hat Yai, Thailand
[Chief Editor's note: I edited this article at 12:09 MST so that it was not featured article as originally posted simply because of the number of other articles already posted on this subject, and also partly but less so because of the over-the-top ranting style.]
[Proofreader's note: this article was edited for spelling and typos on June 7, 2006]
The CBC (and all others) have been spewing the same fear mongering.
The whole thing seems engineered to allow police and CSIS to dramatically increase their budgets. Now every backwater town is going to scream for an 'anti-terrorist unit', and BC ferries is talking about doing trunk searches. Every right-wing gun-nut is screaming 'I TOLD YOU SO!!!' including most of the police chiefs. Our own Admiral here in Victoria, I think he commands two frigates and a Nanaimo bath-tub squadron, is harping that this is the BIG WAKE-UP CALL for Canadians.
Yes indeed, Captain Howdy. The Canadian Police State is almost on us. Where do I sign up with the rebellion?
"So, mein fuhr Harper, when are you going to take me away to the concentration camp and put me in the oven? How soon till Mr. Stockwell "Aryan Nation" Day makes me carry around a mandatory ID card, or will you just make everyone who gets a passport give up their freedom and liberty? Nice to see you don't give a damn about Canada and Canadians and are instead, focusing on doing everythng you can to get a majority government. You are not governing Canada, you are on the campaign trail.
I like the Conservatives ability to be fiscally conservative, I think that is great and government still needs serious cuttbacks. However, I do not like the fact that the Conservative party is morally conservative, do not impose your values upon others, gay marriage up for a vote? Are you a retard? What a waste of my tax dollar. Could you not find a more pressing issue to deal with, lets say, terrorism perhaps? Ted Menzies, if you can be bothered to read these e-mails instead of bin them, you have a nephew who is gay, where do you stand on this issue? Is this bring up the gay marriage debate just something to impress your buddy King George with?
How about you add a law to your books that insures the sick perverts who rape the kids I teach stay in jail for their full sentence instead of being let out to make room for pot smokers? When they are let out they go back to their ex's place and rape their son again. This happened this week in my classroom, thank you so much for being the morality police and saving me from faggets getting married and pot heads smoking up. I guess in your God is great, Little House on the Prairie fantasy world this kind of crap is SOOOOO important. Forget the fact that a boy I teach is in a hospital intensive care unit, because of your stupid laws. You saved Canada from faggets and pot heads so we can all rest easy now. Now I suppose you are going to save Canada from the evill terrorists, so what's next, a national ID card? Maybe we all have to log onto the evil internet with our unique National ID number? As I have said before, I will violently resist being told that I need to carry around a mandatory national biometric ID card. I have drawn my line in the sand and if it is crossed I will do whatever I feel neccessary to stop this stupidity. I am a born and breed Canadian citizen, not a bull on some hick Alberta ranch to be chipped. I had three great uncles die in WWII and they did not die so you could bring back the Reich. A national ID card will not improve our security at all, this has been proven time and time again. When Madrid was bombed Spain had national ID cards, it did nothing to stop that from happening, nothing. Charles Clarke said that a national ID in the UK would not have stopped the 7/7 bombings. Tell that moron Stockwell Day to shove the idea of an ID card up his arse.
You want scum bag terrorists to stop trying to hurt us? Don't go around the world with the US imperialists killing whoever does not want to convert to Christianity, sorry, free trade for US companies. Take you Nazi fantasies and piss off. You want my vote? You best become a moral liberal, and if you think Canadians follow your morals then you are a true idiot. Canadians are not Americans, Canadians are not Americans, repeat this phrase over and over until you understand."
I signed my name and address on the bottom, I want them to know that I will react if I am told I must get a mandatory ID card, I am willing to die on that hill if it ever presents itself. I think ID cards are not something to just casually mention anytime you open your mouth (much like that prick Stockwell Day does). I used the words faggets and pot heads because those are the words the bigoted and homophobic Conservatives understand. When talking to mental retards you have to talk down to their level so they understand you.
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My freedom is more important than your great idea.
– Anonymous
(I may return to the headline for further comment)
Toronto --
Toronto police chief Bill Blair called ffor Muslims and non-Muslims alike to let cooler heads prevail after windows were smashed a a Toronto mosque following arrest of the 17 terror suspects.
My analysis;
CSIS plans tragets and executes a subtrafuge to entrap Muslim youth who may be predisposed tp be pissed off at the actions in Irag and Afganistan.. make a prior to arrest announcement, which sets of a string of events resulting in creating a fear and backlash/vadalisn towards a Tronto mosue and the vandalism may have also bee executed by CSIS (Chances of the "vandals" capture are vip)
irregardless. the situation escalates and the freaking chief of police call for Muslims to let cooler heads prevail
then as an afterthough the spinmasters inculnon-Muslims to have cooler heads
Sheeesh!
is it poo? Or is it Sham-poo
it really don't much matter because the ends have been met and will be ongoing
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The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing.... : Albert Einstein
the actions of CSIS are
set a terrortis to catch a terrorist
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The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing.... : Albert Einstein
Based on what, exactly?
You'll understand if I put more faith in Clayton Ruby's legal expertise than I do yours. Here is what he said in today's Globe (perhaps if you read Smirkingchimp.com a little less you'd have some "informed" to go with your opinion):
"It is certainly not entrapment to send someone a controlled delivery of ammonium nitrate if they ask for it, as long as the police have grounds to believe they were within a category of suspicious people," Mr. Ruby said.
"At the moment, I don't see entrapment."
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RickW
what part of Sting o[eration ain't ya gettin?
MAybe if you were to read some of the recorded antics of CSIS.
... Oh Well, to much to ask for.
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The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing.... : Albert Einstein
I want a PM that the world and his country do not hate so that I don't have to pay for his enormous entourage of security that isn't worth his worthlessness.
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"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music." Friedrich Nietzsche
Good luck with that.