Cartoon Fiasco Brings Out The Worst

Though the pastor brings up some really relevant points, the truth is that the Christian right was the big kid on the block for several hundred years and it has only been recently (the last 2 to 3 generations since WWII) that civil rights have bypassed the traditional views espoused from the Christian pulpit in western civilization. We have not realized a truly egalitarian society yet, where sex, race, orientation, religion mean nothing regarding your standing in society. We may never reach that point, but if we do it will not be because of the church but in spite of it.

I think that the pastor is wrong in drawing the correlation between the reactions to religious desecration by western Christians and middle eastern Islamists. He seems to ascribe western standards of morality to the Islamists in order to question the authenticity of their motives. His arguements thus come across as the whine of the once powerful trying to point out that someone else is just as bad as they ever were, and maybe worse... so please stop hitting us. Pathetic. He denigrates those who criticize the Christian right as cowards who won't pick on Islam, and holds Christianity up as the moral beacon of light since they are in the "habit of turning at least four cheeks (for the slaps and kicks of culture)". Bah! Had someone done something similar regarding Jesus in Europe in the 1600's they would have tortured and burned as a heretic.

His arguements are duplicitous and hollow. Sure, since WWII, Christianity has had to put up with more and more resistance from their flocks in western society as people actually tried to make changes to society in the model of the people and not the model that the archbishops dictated, and as a result, the Christian masses have become less violent than they were say at the time of the crusades (OK, Pat Robertson and a couple of anti-abortion protesters are still about, but they don't have the numbers of followers that they once did). But they had to adapt in order to maintain the flow of cash from the people they were servicing. As a direct result of the political atmosphere, the Christian right lost their political clout (though resurgence of power does occur such as with the Bush regime). This loss of power can be contrasted with the power gains made my the Islamists in their respective countries.

Poor Harry seems to be longing for the time that the Pope could command the fervent masses in the way that the clerics do today. The good reverend should follow his own advice and "get more honest about your own problems, without constantly searching out scapegoats on which to deflect your frustration. "

Don't get me wrong, I think we should all be coming out against the Islamists and telling them where to shove it with respect to the cartoons, I just don't like being told to do it because Christians are good and Islamists are bullies.

Here is some news worthy of my respect.<br />
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<a href="http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/02/13/cartoons060213.html">http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/02/13/cartoons060213.html</a><br />
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I take their opinions of why they posted these cartoons at face value. They are the centre of a huge storm, and people have the right to view them and make up their own minds. Newspapers often publish things they disagree with, if the subject is newsworthy. These cartoons certainly are newsworthy, if not funny. (Though I have to admit, the one about running out of virgins made me chuckle.)<br />
<br />
E

Actually I have not noticed that the newspapers publish the truth or anything remotely resembling the truth. What I notice being published is the agenda of the robber barons. Funny how in a time of all out attack against all things muslim, (especially their natural resources), very few of us see the timing of this manufactured madness as being in any way suspicious. Instead a lot of babble about free speech is spewed from the putrid press lips and the swill swallowed whole by wasted Westerners. The thought that there might be embedded thugs in the spontaneously demonstrating supposed crowd of muslims is anathema to us. Who remembers wag the dog?

Speaking of cartoons bringing out the worst, here is some disturbing news.<br />
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<a href="http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/02/13/muslim-montreal060213.html">http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/02/13/muslim-montreal060213.html</a><br />
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It was only a matter of time before extreme non-muslims decided to turn extreme muslim tactics against moderate muslims. I wonder how muslims feel now that the shoe is on the other foot, and they now fear the same kind of extrimism that they allowed in their house for so long.

It is sad commentary.

I've been seeing another trend too. Back in the 70's, radical muslims in Egypt started killing each other because they weren't 'muslim enough'. It was right around the time of the assassination of Andwar Sadat and the trial of Al-Zaquari (Bin Laden's right hand).

I think this cartoon fiasco will polarize muslims into those who are tolerant and 'westernized' and those who are intolerant and radicalized.


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"I think it's important to always carry enough technology to restart civilization, should it be necessary." Mark Tilden

Is this manufactured?<br />
<br />
<a href="http://www.faithfreedom.org/Announcement/601081013.htm">http://www.faithfreedom.org/Announcement/601081013.htm</a><br />
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This is the kind of people we appease by self censorship.

I hope the good guys win.

But in reality, I don't think they stand a chance. Once a critical mass of fanatics emerge, being a moderate is not a survival trait. What happened to moderate Germans during WW2? What happened to moderate Taliban? What happened to moderate Soviets? What happened to moderate Japanese in WW2? What happened to moderate Iranians during their revolution? What happened to moderate North Koreans? How about the Chinese moderates? How about moderate Chechens? How about moderate Kosovans? How about moderate Croats? How about moderate Jews in Nazi Germany? Moderate natives in colonial USA? Moderate Palestinians?

They all suffered the worst.

I'm really sad about this, but there comes a time when all moderate voices are drowned out. Watching the mostly good Islamic world spiral down the drain is truly heart wrenching.

There comes a time when moderate people must take a stand for basic freedoms. This is why I stand with anyone who would publish the Mohammed cartoons.

You are missing the point. The media is controlled. There is no free speech to be heard or seen coming from the mass media. What is happening is part of an agenda. The agenda deals with the control of all natural resources. Divide and conquer is the name of the game.

Controlled by who? How are they controlled? Please explain in detail?

any clues here


Law 1 Never Outshine the Master
Law 2 Never put too Much Trust in Friends, Learn how to use Enemies
Law 3 Conceal your Intentions
Law 4 Always Say Less than Necessary
Law 5 So Much Depends on Reputation - Guard it with your Life
Law 6 Court Attention at all Cost
Law 7 Get others to do the Work for you, but Always Take the Credit
Law 8 Make other People come to you - use Bait if Necessary
Law 9 Win through your Actions, Never through Argument
Law 10 Infection: Avoid the Unhappy and Unlucky
Law 11 Learn to Keep People Dependent on You
Law 12 Use Selective Honesty and Generosity to Disarm your Victim
Law 13 When Asking for Help, Appeal to People's Self-Interest, Never to their Mercy or Gratitude
Law 14 Pose as a Friend, Work as a Spy
Law 15 Crush your Enemy Totally
Law 16 Use Absence to Increase Respect and Honor
Law 17 Keep Others in Suspended Terror: Cultivate an Air of Unpredictability
Law 18 Do Not Build Fortresses to Protect Yourself - Isolation is Dangerous
Law 19 Know Who You're Dealing with - Do Not Offend the Wrong Person
Law 20 Do Not Commit to Anyone
Law 21 Play a Sucker to Catch a Sucker - Seem Dumber than your Mark
Law 22 Use the Surrender Tactic: Transform Weakness into Power
Law 23 Concentrate Your Forces
Law 24 Play the Perfect Courtier
Law 25 Re-Create Yourself
Law 26 Keep Your Hands Clean
Law 27 Play on People's Need to Believe to Create a Cultlike Following
Law 28 Enter Action with Boldness
Law 29 Plan All the Way to the End
Law 30 Make your Accomplishments Seem Effortless
Law 31 Control the Options: Get Others to Play with the Cards you Deal
Law 32 Play to People's Fantasies
Law 33 Discover Each Man's Thumbscrew
Law 34 Be Royal in your Own Fashion: Act like a King to be treated like one
Law 35 Master the Art of Timing
Law 36 Disdain Things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best Revenge
Law 37 Create Compelling Spectacles
Law 38 Think as you like but Behave like others
Law 39 Stir up Waters to Catch Fish
Law 40 Despise the Free Lunch
Law 41 Avoid Stepping into a Great Man's Shoes
Law 42 Strike the Shepherd and the Sheep will Scatter
Law 43 Work on the Hearts and Minds of Others
Law 44 Disarm and Infuriate with the Mirror Effect
Law 45 Preach the Need for Change, but Never Reform too much at Once
Law 46 Never appear too Perfect
Law 47 Do not go Past the Mark you Aimed for; In Victory, Learn when to Stop
Law 48 Assume Formlessness


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Nothing in this World makes People so Afraid as the Influence of an Independant Minded Individual.
Attrib. Al EINSTEIN

If I understand Milton's point it is as follows:

Controlled by who?

Those who OWN it. the News media is not a public trust, it is a business.

How are they controlled?

The owners says "This is the point of view we want the public to see, and all our reporting will reflect that point of view."

Haven't you ever considered why is it that when you look at the nightly news broadcasts, all the big news outlets cover the same stories, with the same slant?

Milt, do I have it essentially correct?

Sounds like current US Foreign policy.

This may point to the issue of “controlled media”<br />
<a href="http://www.apfn.org/apfn/cfr-members.htm">http://www.apfn.org/apfn/cfr-members.htm</a><br />
<br />
Roster of CFR/Trilateral Commission Members <br />
________________________________________<br />
Members of the Council on Foreign Relations and the Trilateral Commission dominate key positions in America's government, military, industries, media outlets and educational foundations and institutions. The following is a partial list of current CFR members and the positions of influence they hold in society. The CFR's membership is limited to 3,000, and there are only 325 Trilateral Commission members. <br />
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MEDIA: <br />
<br />
CBS: <br />
Laurence A. Tisch, CEO -- CFR <br />
Roswell Gilpatric -- CFR <br />
James Houghton -- CFR, TC <br />
Henry Schacht -- CFR, TC <br />
Dan Rather -- CFR <br />
Richard Hottelet -- CFR <br />
Frank Stanton -- CFR <br />
NBC/RCA: <br />
John F. Welch, CEO -- CFR <br />
Jane Pfeiffer -- CFR <br />
Lester Crystal -- CFR, TC <br />
R.W. Sonnenfeidt -- CFR, TC <br />
John Petty -- CFR <br />
Tom Brokaw -- CFR <br />
David Brinkley -- CFR <br />
John Chancellor -- CFR <br />
Marvin Kalb -- CFR <br />
Irving R. Levine -- CFR <br />
Herbert Schlosser -- CFR <br />
Peter G. Peterson -- CFR <br />
John Sawhill -- CFR <br />
ABC: <br />
Thomas S. Murphy, CEO -- CFR <br />
Barbara Walters -- CFR <br />
John Connor -- CFR <br />
Diane Sawyer -- CFR <br />
John Scall -- CFR <br />
Public Broadcast Service: <br />
Robert Mcneil -- CFR <br />
Jim Lehrer -- CFR <br />
C. Hunter-Gault -- CFR <br />
Hodding Carter III -- CFR <br />
Daniel Schorr -- CFR <br />
Associated Press: <br />
Stanley Swinton -- CFR <br />
Harold Anderson -- CFR <br />
Katharine Graham -- CFR, TC <br />
Reuters: <br />
Michael Posner -- CFR <br />
Baltimore Sun: <br />
Henry Trewhitt -- CFR <br />
Washington Times: <br />
Arnaud De Borchgrave -- CFR <br />
Children's TV Workshop (Sesame Street): <br />
Joan Ganz Cooney, Pres. -- CFR <br />
Cable News Network: <br />
W. Thomas Johnson, Pres. -- TC <br />
Daniel Schorr -- CFR <br />
U.S. News & World Report: <br />
David Gergen -- TC <br />
New York Times Co.: <br />
Richard Gelb -- CFR <br />
William Scranton -- CFR, TC <br />
John F. Akers, Dir. -- CFR <br />
Louis V. Gerstner, Jr., Dir. -- CFR <br />
George B. Munroe, Dir. -- CFR <br />
Donald M. Stewart, Dir. -- CFR <br />
Cyrus R. Vance, Dir. -- CFR <br />
A.M. Rosenthal -- CFR <br />
Seymour Topping -- CFR <br />
James Greenfield -- CFR <br />
Max Frankel -- CFR <br />
Jack Rosenthal -- CFR <br />
John Oakes -- CFR <br />
Harrison Salisbury -- CFR <br />
H.L. Smith -- CFR <br />
Steven Rattner -- CFR <br />
Richard Burt -- CFR <br />
Flora Lewis -- CFR <br />
Time, Inc.: <br />
Ralph Davidson -- CFR <br />
Donal M. Wilson -- CFR <br />
Henry Grunwald -- CFR <br />
Alexander Heard -- CFR <br />
Sol Linowitz -- CFR <br />
Thomas Watson, Jr. -- CFR <br />
Strobe Talbott -- CFR <br />
Newsweek/Washington Post: <br />
Katharine Graham -- CFR <br />
N. Deb. Katzenbach -- CFR <br />
Robert Christopher -- CFR <br />
Osborne Elliot -- CFR <br />
Phillip Geyelin -- CFR <br />
Murry Marder -- CFR <br />
Maynard Parker -- CFR <br />
George Will -- CFR, TC <br />
Robert Kaiser -- CFR <br />
Meg Greenfield -- CFR <br />
Walter Pincus -- CFR <br />
Murray Gart -- CFR <br />
Peter Osnos -- CFR <br />
Don Oberdorfer -- CFR <br />
Dow Jones & Co (Wall Street Journal): <br />
Richard Wood -- CFR <br />
Robert Bartley -- CFR, TC <br />
Karen House -- CFR <br />
National Review: <br />
Wm. F. Buckley, Jr. -- CFR <br />
Readers Digest: <br />
George V. Grune, CEO -- CFR <br />
William G. Bowen, Dir. -- CFR <br />
Syndicated Columnists <br />
Geogia Anne Geyer -- CFR <br />
Ben J. Wattenberg -- CFR <br />
<br />
<p>---<br>Nothing in this World makes People so Afraid as the Influence of an Independant Minded Individual.<br />
Attrib. Al EINSTEIN

<<What I notice being published is the agenda of the robber barons. Funny how in a time of all out attack against all things Muslim, (especially their natural resources)...>>

An "all out attack"? Good grief. You mean like the student paper in PEI that was banned. Every nutless media on the continent has gone out of their way to prevent fanatics' sensitive eyes from seeing some black and white cartoons. Almost nothing has been "published" to keep from offending (sorry...provoking) fanatics who don't believe a woman should be able to drive an automobile or play sports. Western governments have apologized for the cartoons as if they are responsible for all media - as is the case in the countries they apologized to. Under attack? Right. That's why tens of millions of Muslims live in the West, and only a handful of westerners live in the middle east.

<<(especially their natural resources)...>>

Robber barons? Lol. Iran extracts oil for $5/barell, then sells it for $70/barell.