Casualties Of War -Suicide

I can relate. When the US ambassador decorated members of my unit with the Bronze Star a couple years ago, there were less than 25% of us left. The rumour is that there is a 10 year 'survival' limit once you retire from military service. From all I've seen, that statistic holds up. I put a friend who served 26 years and retired in June 1994 in the ground two weeks ago.<p> I feel for those soldiers.<p> "Vietnam is a war of the unwilling<br> Led by the incompetent,<br> defending the ungrateful"<br><p> I read that somewhere. No wonder they punch their own ticket.<p><p>---<br>"History does not repeat itself, but it does rhyme" Mark Twain <br />"The greatest price of not participating in politics is being governed by your inferiors." Plato

No one should be surprised about this. For everything we know about PTSD, it should have been obvious that some soldiers would get it during a war like this--and being on a mission which is not very successful, with lots of casualties, long terms of service, and controversy at home is likely to lead to more stress on soldiers and therefore more problems like PTSD.

Sometimes symptoms get worse when soldiers go home, since they are supposed to be fitting back into a \"normal\" society that views killing as a crime and which is full of people who can\'t relate to the experiences of people who served--leading to problems like the men beating their wives or not being functional or even (scary) doing something like Tim McVeigh.

Another bill American society will be paying long after the war is over. Sigh...we told you so...

The sad part of this story is that it really isn\'t being told, they hardly report on the actually casualties since the official war ended; but for those machos who sent these people to war, I am sure they don\'t want anyone to think that these young people aren\'t enjoying this blood bath. Although I suspect any war is brutal and will have consequences after the fact, a war that is not seen as legitimate by the world, and has no obvious plan in effect must be very frustrating! Many of these guys went over to Iraq believing they would be in and out, back home in no time with few casualties; the truth might have prepared them better but then the public would have seen the truth also; no real plan for after the bomb and awe, no plan for the people, the infrastructure etc. and instead of telling soldiers you\'ll be home in 3 mths or 6 mths etc, tell them they are heading out with no specific time on their return.

I am sure the war and sights and sounds of war are brutal, but the chaos of a government that doesn\'t know what the hell they are doing, surely can\'t help. Although the soldiers saw the suffering of these people, or were told, it must be worse to have believed you were going to save them, only to be faced with hostility, because you can\'t!

There was no reason for the US to attack Iraq. That is a given, since they have not found evidence of WMD.

That does not mean Iraq didn\'t transfer their weapons and other materials to other countries, such a Syria, but we need proof !!

Without that, we have to condemn Bush for moving unilaterally against Iraq, with the British, having the same incorrect intelligence, that I have to find the US in contravention to all UN demands for proof.

Bush is a warmonger, and Clark put it in perspective:

Bush wanted to subject the entire Muslim area in the middle east to succumb to the American ideal of democracy.

Since Bush is a Born-Again Christian, with more than a few indiscretions in his past, I find the Bush administration to be less than believable.



---
"Arrogance in Politics is unacceptable"
Jim Callaghan
Minden, Ontario
705-286-1860
www.misterc.ca

Hey doc. My dad knows a guy who used to work at a tech company in the States, where my dad as worked for a while. He was an ex-marine, a computer animator, and a VERY nice guy......he was very self-depricating, almost Canadian....anbd he was VERY messed-up, mentally....nothing specific, he\'s just not prone to behaving conventionally anymore, which is interesting, but I have a feeling he\'s been traumatized for life.

I\'ve heard marines have to be able to kill a person without showing emotion.......how does the training of Canadians soldiers differ? (We seem to reflect out society, calmer, more calculating.) I know how we differ in performance, but how do we train?....I know a couple people at my high school who trained at a paint-ball facility in Northern Ontario, just starting out, but I don\'t see them chanting \"Kill\" 20 times a second like the marines do.

Also, I read on ericblumrich.com that cancer-rates in ex-Vietnam, Kosovo, and Iraq soldiers is 7-13 times above normal, or something like that....due to depleted urnaium, with a half-life of 4.5 billion years. Goodie.

Want to be a reporter in Iraq now? hehh.

Paint ball isn't a fair training regiment. Paint Balls can maim, and hurt quite a bit, but won't kill you. Having the ability to kill you most certainally provides some incentive.<p> To answer your question - I have no idea. I wasn't trained by the US Marines. I don't believe any human can take any life and not show emotion, be it human or animal. Because the emotion is internalized and not shown externally does not mean there was no emotion. I suspect your fathers friend felt this, and as a result is all twisted up inside. If you can take a life and feel nothing, you need to be somewhere that they don't give you live ammunition.<p> If there is a difference, Canadians are trained to protect themselves and their unit first, with killing as the untimate means to do that. Deterrence is the first line however.<p> A little insight: When on guard duty patrolling a fence or gate, we are taught the proper response to an intruder or unchallenged unknown person is 1) Yell "Halt" 2) Shoot to kill. 3) Yell "Who goes there?" 4) Fire 1 round into the air. Now, this isn't the official procedure, the official one is somewhat in a different order, but this procedure mostly follows the standard, but keeps your life and the lives of your unit in greater safety than the official one. During an investigation, it is indistinguishable from the official one, and if the enemy knows the unofficial procedure will most likely be used, there is your deterrent.<p> <p>---<br>"History does not repeat itself, but it does rhyme" Mark Twain <br />"The greatest price of not participating in politics is being governed by your inferiors." Plato

Yeah, just wait, Gulf War Syndrome II will come up again. And the US government still hasn\'t acknowledged if there even is such a thing, despite a LOT of evidence that (duh) radiation is bad for you...

PS I want to say of course not all people who suffer from trauma are violent or dangerous and I didn\'t mean to imply that--I was just trying to say that there are a lot of potential problems for soldiers trying to readjust to civilian life.

And of course, let\'s also not forget all of the Iraqi people who are dying--and we have no tally of mental problems/suicide rates etc for them. A child who sees his mother killed or an Iraqi soldier in combat is just as likely to be traumatized as a US soldier. Look what a legacy is being left behind in Iraq as well!

The high human cost of war is EXACTLY the reason it should be a LAST resort.

Interesting. The paintball-trainging was for reserves, I believe, pretty low on the totem-pole.

I once e-mailed George Bush, this was about a month before the US invaded Iraq, and I basically told him that the USA and the world would be better off if the USA would just channel their energies and resources toward peace and eliminating poverty, which would ultimately reduce terrorism. I got a response from some lady, an aide, I can`t remember her name, and she told me that the white house appreciates correspondance but I ignored some set of rules regarding the content of my message. That was it!

---
Dave Ruston

So it\'s not all roses, glory, pillage and plunder for Rome\'s Legions. Oh pity

regards,
Spartacus

hey statist loser!, not voting or destroying your ballot IS a vote - THE LOUDEST VOTE THERE IS

Unless Canadians can defend themselves, Canada is a fiction

Hehh.....but at least you got a response, Dave, I mean come on........the Liberals stopped answering E-mails several years ago.....and it\'s better than Jack Layton has done.