Poor Have No ( Blanket ) Right To Counsel

Posted on Sunday, May 27 at 13:54 by Diogenes
Enacted in 1993, the province's Social Service Tax Amendment Act imposed a 7-per-cent tax on the purchase price of legal services. While B.C. maintained that the purpose of the tax was to fund legal aid, the proceeds were lumped in with general revenue, making it difficult or impossible to ascertain how much of it actually ended up enhancing access to justice. Sometimes, access to legal services can be vital in a fair justice system, the court said. However, it said that “a review of the constitutional text, the jurisprudence and the history of the concept does not support the respondent's contention that there is a broad general right to legal counsel as an aspect of, or precondition to, the rule of law.” “The court says it is not its job to create or encourage systemic remedies,” said Bruce Ryder, a law professor at York University's Osgoode Hall Law School. “It leaves the task to governments – the very governments who have underfunded or cancelled legal aid programs. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070525.wscoc0526/BNStory/National/?page=rss&id=RTGAM.20070525.wscoc0526 [Proofreader's note: this article was edited for spelling and typos on May 28, 2007]

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  1. Sun May 27, 2007 9:51 pm
    Once again,laws made by the rich, for the rich. What a bunch of hypocrites, those who run our legal system! As long as some are oppressed, then nobody is free! How can justice possibly exist if access to the courts and legal representation is simply unaffordable to some? And even in legal aid cases, I`ve seen lawyers do even less than the bare minimum simply because the person they are supposed to represent can`t afford to fork out huge amounts of cash! This is yet another example of economic bigotry! But even supposed enlightened people are blind to it because we don`t attach a race or sex to it. But it is still discrimination!

    ---
    Dave Ruston

  2. Sun May 27, 2007 10:17 pm
    Not according to one opinion here




    “ As previously mentioned, you can rest assured that these laws weren't implemented without considerable thought and, as indicated, not without a number of safeguards in place to ensure these wouldn't be applied in a 'frivolous' manner….”

    It is that we have rested that the situations in law occur!

    Authority, we are told comes from the people.

    I suggest the inclusion of the word ‘vigilant’ between ‘the’ and ‘people’



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    "It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities."
    —Sir Josiah Stamp

  3. by RPW
    Mon May 28, 2007 12:03 am
    <blockquote> Once again,laws made by the rich, for the rich. </blockquote> Laws made by the rich, but for the poor, I would say. After all, the rich are above the law........I mean, what "important" person is going to say, "Please, pass this law quickly, so I know what I may or may not do!"? Laws rather, are made by those whose "civic duty" (self-imposed) is to tell <b><U>others</U></b> what the latter may or may not do.........<p>---<br>"When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change." <br />
    -Max Planck<br />
    <br />

  4. Mon May 28, 2007 3:37 am
    Basically an arresting officer must now modify his version of your rights, when reading them to you. "You have the right to legal council, only if you can afford one. If you cannot afford an attorney,.......!"

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    Expect little from life and get more from it.

  5. Mon May 28, 2007 4:35 am
    What do you expect? We're living in a time where justice
    is bought, by those who can afford it. And if you can't
    afford it, don't expect justice - expect to get screwed!

  6. Mon May 28, 2007 4:44 am
    Geez! are youse guys ever cynical!

    ---
    "It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities."
    —Sir Josiah Stamp

  7. Mon May 28, 2007 5:10 am
    So the government is creating taxes to fund something specific but then
    using the monies for something else and the court refuses to uphold that
    intention. Is that the gist of this? If so, it comes back to the same thing;
    unaccountable government. Government that does not serve the people it is
    hired to serve, really shouldn't have a job? I think that we need an overhaul,
    but we will have to begin with a law that protects the interest of the
    everyman/woman from those who abuse their position. Employers generally
    have more rights then employees from what I've seen in labour laws, with one
    exception and that is government. No wonder the world is revolving around
    the few, they've got it all figured out.

    Perhaps it has to do with perception? If we saw ourselves as employers and
    were not intimidated by our employees we might be capable of changing the
    landscape to a more equal situation.

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    "aaaah and the whisper of thousands of tiny voices became a mighty deafening roar and they called it 'freedom'!"' Canadians Acting Humanely at home & everywhere

  8. Mon May 28, 2007 6:28 am
    Good points CWC Is that the ol fighter back ?
    (it's an 'in' thing folks)
    Good points and can be echoed on "If the NDP is to survive in B.C., a new leader must be found" a long with Peter Dimitrov's points.
    I too have has thoughts similar to yoursw CWC and believe it otr not, folks, much of what i have offered here gos to Catherines points about Who's da Boss


    ---
    "It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities."
    —Sir Josiah Stamp

  9. Mon May 28, 2007 4:19 pm
    That isn't what the judgement says. It says 'If you want to sue someone for a tort against you, you have to foot the bill'. Eg: Fighting or initiating a Divorce. As the last sentence says: "proof of a constitutional entitlement to legal services in relation to proceedings in courts and tribunals dealing with rights and obligations."

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    The preceding comment deals with mature subject matter, however immaturely presented. Viewer discretion is advised.

  10. Mon May 28, 2007 5:33 pm
    "That isn't what the judgement says.."

    My mistake! However if the "need to sue" can't be done, the poor are left out. IE: A friend was going broke trying to make a living with a cube van. He had one final payment to make before getting ownership of the van. The leasing company took the van away one night with the explaination that they had someone else who would be leasing the van. The friend was able to see a lawyer who was adamant that the leasing company broke the lease agreement. However he required a fee to continue. My friend got aide from me because legal aid nor the lawyer would. The van was the only revenue this guy had to get started again.

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    Expect little from life and get more from it.

  11. Mon May 28, 2007 7:42 pm
    I totally agree. Justice is for the rich, and the 7% tax BC has levied should be put directly into legal aid, and legal aid should cover the kind of case you highlight.

    Isn't Legal Aid the starting point for many criminal lawyers? What if they also had torte lawyers working for the joy of the experience? Corporations like that rental company wouldn't allow it though.

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    The preceding comment deals with mature subject matter, however immaturely presented. Viewer discretion is advised.

  12. by siljan
    Mon May 28, 2007 9:08 pm
    "The Law in its majestic equality
    forbids the rich as well as the poor
    to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets,
    and to steal bread."

    Antole France

  13. Tue May 29, 2007 1:54 am
    "The Charter of Rights and Freedoms does not give impoverished litigants a blanket right to obtain legal counsel, the Supreme Court of Canada ruled Friday."

    That is true - but that doesn't mean it shouldn't!

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    If there was ever a time for Canadians to become pushy - now is the time - for time is running out on this nation called Canada.

  14. by RPW
    Tue May 29, 2007 2:31 am
    Good One!!

    ---
    "When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change."
    -Max Planck



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