We must ask why we enjoy the separation of church and state. Faith hardliners may well say it’s because godless leaders didn’t and don’t want to be bothered with the demands of faith.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
If we look at the political history from which Canada derives, we see the truth. To begin, the battle of Catholics and Protestants for state power in England was long and bloody, creating mayhem, chaos, schism, discrimination, and terror. (Such fights happen elsewhere, of course: the battle between Christians and Muslims - the Crusades - and between Muslims and Hindus, etc.)
Out of the English mayhem, Protestant William of Orange was invited to invade England and take the throne in 1688. In his reign, the principle of religious toleration was set out. Though weak at first, religious toleration came to mean a person may have any faith, hold any public office, and live free from religious harassment and violence. Religious toleration assures the peace of the realm.
Strangely, too, that is why a law (still in effect) was enunciated stating that no English monarch may be a Roman Catholic. Faith hard-liners might say the law was passed out of Protestant bigotry. It was passed to assure “the peace of the realm” - to end the bloodshed and terror bred in religious battles to win the throne. That apparent act of bigotry must be seen in terms of the social chaos caused in England by religious fighting. Combined with growing religious toleration, the law carried less and less threat to Roman Catholics and other non-Protestants as time passed.
France and New France – from whom Canada’s political history also derives – tell a similar story. In the 1620s and afterward, Protestants (the “Huguenots” in French) were forbidden to migrate to New France. As W.J Eccles, still one of Canada’s finest historians of early European Canada, writes: “the presence of a sizable body of Huguenots practicing their religion in New France would only have been a source of bitter disputes that could only have disrupted, weakened, and perhaps wrecked the colony.” (Canada Under Louis XlV, M&S, 1964, p. 26)
The famous Cardinal Richelieu (1858-1642) may have been a Roman Catholic bigot, setting up that regulation. But even Louis XIII – who feared Richelieu, his chief minister - said of him that his one motive in public affairs was the welfare of the realm.
Religious toleration must accompany the separation of church and state. It says you may believe what you like, you may have the faith you please, but you may not shape the state to any one “religion” or “faith,” persecuting and discriminating against “religions” and “faiths” not your own. If there is to be peace in the realm, there must be freedom to think and act differently from others in matters of faith.
Because of the incendiary nature that accompanies the mix of state and religion, differences in Canada about same-sex marriage and the right to abortion, for instance, MUST be argued on political and constitutional grounds, however much the positions of some politicians and some social activists may be motivated by religious doctrine or dogma.
“The realm” in the modern world, moreover, has expanded, increasing the demand for religious toleration. Migration of peoples has increased all over the world. Modern communication has shrunken its size. Canada, in particular, has been and is a country hospitable to migrants of numerous faiths. Religious intolerance in our politics could only mean a breakdown of Canadian society.
Unfortunately, the U.S.A. influences many Canadians. Unfortunately, it influences many of the people who say the separation of church and state is a “distortion,” a perversion, an unnatural condition. The U.S.A. wants global power without global religious toleration. It wants to be the heart of a global community that possesses neither religious toleration nor the separation of church and state. At home it has never been especially tolerant. The burning of witches was a U.S. entertainment. From its beginning in 1776 until 1960, moreover, no Roman Catholic was able to become president of the United States. In Canada, twenty-nine years after Confederation, a francophone Roman Catholic became prime minister.
The U.S. has developed a Christian fundamentalism that it wants to impose on other countries. Not only is its barely disguised war against Islam (mixing racism with religious bigotry) a matter of great concern; but the U.S. also tries to tell Christian countries how to act in matters of faith and dogma. Very recently, offering $40 million to Brazil to assist it in the battle against AIDS, the U.S insisted Brazil condemn the use of condoms and criminalize prostitution.
The Brazilians refused the $40 million saying – among other things – that cooperation with informed prostitutes was an important way to lessen the spread of AIDS.
There can be no question that the present religious intolerance of the U.S. government is helping to seed death, mayhem, chaos, schism, discrimination, and terror around the world.
Canadians must fight against such intolerance in this country. When anyone in Canada says the separation of church and state is a distortion or perversion or an unnatural condition, tell that person to read history. He or she will see that religious toleration in Canada as well as the separation of church and state were floated to us as precious gifts on an ocean of blood spilled in religious strife.
[Proofreader's note: this article was edited for spelling and typos on June 5, 2005]
What they do do is create curtains of falsehoods to hide what was once in view,
In the so called Christian world Rome still wields enormous economic power. The royals are hardly ‘begging’
It all ends up as what is seen is that which is presented for general consumption, In other words a fiction, a legal fiction at that.
One contributor here has copped to ‘still studying law’ aside from the fact it shows in his posts by the way he is able to bait y’all it likely it is good ‘practice’ for him while those who take the bait are so engrossed in survival their focus is diverted from the fact there IS a curtain.
The article itself is almost as much udder bollocks as well, proving that political philosophy shouldn't be dumbed down to bloggers and journalists. A quick selective reading of history, some vaguely tangential remarks and you have yourself an article.
As any irishman knows, the holding of public offices was off limits to catholics well into the 20th century here in Canada, so we don't need to go all the way back to the hugeunots. Older Quebecers will still hold a grudge against the english protestants who basically ran their province until the sixties. That Canada is a protestant nation is well evidenced in our loyalist traditions, many even claim the 'quiet revolution' in Quebec was more about getting Quebec catholics 'out of church' than anything else. While religion has usually been fanned to the flames, often it is far more about politics and cultural differences. Read some history on the 'work ethic' aspects of protestism and catholicism and you find some very interesting themes. William of Orange didn't last that long, and far more lasting is the Church of England which sanctified the King rather than the Pope. The english are still the only people nuts enough to espouse the 'divine right of kings', meaning that their monarchy is chosen by god.
This transfers down into enshrining 'the state' as the new church. Watch the parliamentary channel sometime and count the number of 'rituals' that are evidenced there. That lawyers still wear robes and we call elected officials 'right honourable' is not a weird coincidence of history.
Trudeau, of course, was noted for saying 'the state has no place in the bedrooms of the nation'. It is supremely ironic then that he added that great caveat-'until I invoke martial law in which case ALL your rights go out the window and we'll be breaking into your bedroom shortly'.
The idea that humanism is somehow the beacon of rights is quite absurd. Note the restriction here to two issues-gay rights and abortion. Of course, the two are markedly dissimilar, abortion is argued even by the most fascist fundamentalist as the rights of the unborn child. That is hardly the 'discrimination' which is argued as the primae facie of human rights in the gay rights issue.
We can go further to see how crazy the whole straw man is as we note that our Charter didn't recognize many new rights, it merely enshrined rights which had been previously granted under various bills in the past. For example, it is interesting to note that we 'have the right to elect a representative to the legislature'. That's it? Why is there no right to elect a check and balance in the form of a senator? Why are there no rights of citizens to get rid of a crooked politician?
The point of the above is simply to show how the protestant 'church' has morphed into the state and how it is no beacon of rationality and tolerance painted in the article. In fact, the opposite is probably true. Why, for example, do we not have the most basic of rights which affect our lives-namely food, water, clothing and shelter? What the hell good does it do me to have a 'freedom of the press' when I can't feed or clothe myself? These are VERY very very basic rights but they aren't granted in our 'state' and so every year people die of the toxic effects of their environment or simply the inability to gain shelter.
It is not a coincidence that the most vocal groups that are pushing for the enshrining of such rights are not political groups but CHURCHES. The article makes up the idea that somehow the 'good' effects of religion are contractualized-far from it. If that were the case then natives would still have their religion, one which espouses the sanctity of the environment-instead we don't let them near it. Like many christian organizations in the past and present the native religion expresses a communal belonging with nature. Of course our strain of protestantism with our good old fashioned work ethic can't have any of that, in fact many in our 'humanistic' state are now lobbying to enshrine private property rights in our charter. So the rights we do have are the vague ephemeral rights which are usually useless to most people or the few protections like against discrimination based on, say, gender. In fact if you read the charter the protection of rights based on sexual disposition aren't even in there! They were 'read in' by the supreme court by a ruling of 5-4-hardly the bastion of egalitarianism that one would expect. Meanwhile, the united church recognized and has conducted gay marriages for the past ten years.
Even the discriminatory protections of the charter don't go far. For example, for generations people, particularly through churches but not exclusively, have lobbied for protection from discrimination based on income. The poor and low income have been complaining about the constant discrimination they get from the highly state subsidized banking sector. Have we seen any progress in our secular state?
The greatest threat to our 'sovereignty' I feel is the corporation and its ill effects. This entity was a complete creation of the humanist state with little impact from religion, to me it has done as much evil as the most warped religous acts in Canada. If anything, our 'state' needs a little more religion.
As far as the states goes, here again is a limited reading of issues. If the american state were truly as dictated, well, dissuaging the use of condoms would mean that the President and ruling party were CATHOLIC, not protestant. Protestants have no problem with rubbers. It seems a little bass ackwards that a protestant government is trying to get a catholic country to stop using condoms and the catholic country is refusing! I wouldn't read too much into that, Canada works on a very similar level and often has 'strings attached' to it's very miserly foreign aid. Most of those strings are imperial in nature, but are often designed so that they insult the government to which it is offered yet placate voters at home. This way the offer was made, but because the beneficient wouldn't adhere to 'common sense requests' it is then rescinded.
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RickW
"The U.S.A. wants global power without global religious toleration. It wants to be the heart of a global community that possesses neither religious toleration nor the separation of church and state. At home it has never been especially tolerant."
Utterly untrue and incendiary. I would plead to the self-declared and irreverent "evil Americans" lurking about this site to help keep the peace and entirely discount such nonsense (ie: pleeze don't take this bait, it will only encourage more of same).
"The burning of witches was a U.S. entertainment."
Yeah, I remember that. Ah, no, wait, that was Burning Man. But I do recall something about burning witches ... way back when we all were a**holes ... and yet, something more about a chief prosecutor who died renouncing his actions ...
Many sites attempting to illustrate the vernacular use of the word "hyperbole" might be interested in linking to this particular statement and its context.
"From its beginning in 1776 until 1960, moreover, no Roman Catholic was able to become president of the United States."
"In Canada, twenty nine years after Confederation, a francophone Roman Catholic became prime minister."
Yeah, and where I grew up this side of the border, the Jr. C hockey team from the next township was *still* named after protestant cross-burners. Drive thru the many small towns and cities in Ontario and probably elsewhere in Canada, you'll note the concentration of Mac's on one side of the mill river and Mc's on the other. The latter downwind from the plants, of course.
"There can be no question that the present religious intolerance of the U.S. government is helping to seed death, mayhem, chaos, schism, discrimination, and terror around the world."
Actually, it is an entirely valid question, one nobody should be afraid to ask or discuss constructively.
Sure, God apparently speaks to George W., as luck would have it encouraging him to continue as he had already planned. But there are millions of Americans of quiet, personal faith who are not falling for it, and plenty of the opposite kind of Canadian who are.
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Dave Ruston
You are absolutely right, there is a movement afoot reminiscent of corporatism, fascism and theocracy. I say "reminiscent" because if we are too quick to identify the beast based only on the nouns we know and prefer, we may also be too quick to misjudge its prime movers, thus missing the opportunity for all but the hard way through it.
You are also correct that this phenomenon is not confined to the United States (ask over half the french or 60% of the dutch), which functions only as an engine of stability and reserve currency, and from which these forces would dearly love to sever all domestic accountability.
"Frankly, I`m tired of all religions. Nobody knows who God is, or if there`s more than one God, or if there is even a God at all. All religions are bogus!"
For you, then religeon is a "bad fact" (one that you may not like, but is not going anywhere anytime soon): at least that is your most constructive hope. Radical secularism will get you nowhere just as fast as Pat Roberston or Ayatollah-whatshisname making brash, impolitic rants about muslims/christians (take your pick). "All religeons are bogus!" Congrats, you sent Stockwell Day some voters. That wasn't your intent, one would hope.
Reasonable people of all faiths (or lack thereof) are capable of agreeing that the "religeous nuclear option" in public policy debate--"because God says so"--is a dangerous cop-out to let a politician away with, I'd think even more so if it was your faith (s)he is pretending to represent. Like I said, people of real faith can smell this a mile away just as well as your average agnostic, humanist, athiest or what have you--unless the air has already been fouled with fear, intolerance and disrespect.
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"There are two ways to slide easily through life: to believe everything or to doubt everything. Both ways save us from thinking."
Alfred Korzybski
<br />
"And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need."<br />
<br />
Too many? I don't think so...........<br />
<p>---<br>RickW
Freedom fighters in Iraq are still called insurgents in the media and get away with it. The world has been shut out of america and the constition shut down. What does this mean for the world also! Another nazi regime! If the world sees another U.S. election (humorus) and they don't straighten up they deserve what ever they get if they don't wake up. That was much neede venting. Thank you.
when in reality they ain't even close
hence, Too Many
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"There are two ways to slide easily through life: to believe everything or to doubt everything. Both ways save us from thinking."
Alfred Korzybski
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RickW