[Marcarc]

It depends what you mean by 'protection'. The reality is that for protection against invasion, you don't need soldiers at all, all you need is a deterrent, like some nuclear warheads with targeting capabilities. THat's science, research and production. Against 'terrorism', again, that's far easier-stop terrorizing other countries. <br /> <br /> The only 'terrorist activity' that resulted in violence since the 50's came during the 70's from the FLQ. Ironic that they spent so much time and effort to run the communist party out, and violence comes from irate Quebecers. Anybody who thinks Quebec didn't have very legitimate grievances doesn't know much about Quebec. Terrorism from disenfranchised parties comes for a reason, usually because people are tired of getting screwed over.<br /> <br /> Personally, I think the MILITARY are the welfare bums. These people for the most part are either psychos who want to kill people, or too stupid to get through university-I"ve known lots of both and our military friend, if he IS military, certainly portrays the irony of having bigoted and ignorant people engaged in 'peacekeeping'. It's no surprise that something like Somalia happened before, and would again. The difference is no doubt the military has learned what is necessary to make sure people don't find out about it.<br /> <br /> I've got a cousin who's been in the military for ten years, he couldn't even get through the bird courses at one of the dumbest universities in the country. Now he has a butthead job in the milatary, and after ten years he earns more than most PHD research scientists. <br /> <br /> Since we're sharing opinions, I'd have the MILITARY cleaning all that dogshit-hell, most of the time they aren't doing anything anyway. Pissing away money on endless training they could get with a video game.<br /> <br /> Oh yeah, a good percentage of those 'welfare moms' are single thanks to deadbeats in the military-go live in a military town and see.

[Armyguy]

[QUOTE BY= Marcarc] It depends what you mean by 'protection'. The reality is that for protection against invasion, you don't need soldiers at all, all you need is a deterrent, like some nuclear warheads with targeting capabilities. THat's science, research and production. Against 'terrorism', again, that's far easier-stop terrorizing other countries. <br /> <br /> The only 'terrorist activity' that resulted in violence since the 50's came during the 70's from the FLQ. Ironic that they spent so much time and effort to run the communist party out, and violence comes from irate Quebecers. Anybody who thinks Quebec didn't have very legitimate grievances doesn't know much about Quebec. Terrorism from disenfranchised parties comes for a reason, usually because people are tired of getting screwed over.<br /> <br /> Personally, I think the MILITARY are the welfare bums. These people for the most part are either psychos who want to kill people, or too stupid to get through university-I"ve known lots of both and our military friend, if he IS military, certainly portrays the irony of having bigoted and ignorant people engaged in 'peacekeeping'. It's no surprise that something like Somalia happened before, and would again. The difference is no doubt the military has learned what is necessary to make sure people don't find out about it.<br /> <br /> I've got a cousin who's been in the military for ten years, he couldn't even get through the bird courses at one of the dumbest universities in the country. Now he has a butthead job in the milatary, and after ten years he earns more than most PHD research scientists. <br /> <br /> Since we're sharing opinions, I'd have the MILITARY cleaning all that dogshit-hell, most of the time they aren't doing anything anyway. Pissing away money on endless training they could get with a video game.<br /> <br /> Oh yeah, a good percentage of those 'welfare moms' are single thanks to deadbeats in the military-go live in a military town and see.[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Quebec has issues? What english people want to speak english but the language police won't let them? I have been to Quebec many times, the base I am at is right across from Quebec. They are the most OOOOO give me more people I have seen.<br /> <br /> So you support terrorists? Maybe we should just go on welfare, and make 2-3000$ a month. Maybe, we could have you protect us? Your so tuff and strong OOOOOO. And knowevery thing. So what your job in life? Come on, I know you may have one? It maybe pack grocery for lil old ladies? <br /> <br /> I know your anti-military because you tryed to get in and you failed the PT test, your fat. Or your mommy won't let you? You and some others here, won't allowed to play with the big boys? And now your friends are respected and your not. <br /> <br /> As for welfare bums, Most soldiers 80% have highschool and 10% have college or above. I have a degree in History and a Aircraft Engineer cert. You cannot get in the military unless you have graduated. Yes some people do get in without. But that is very few.<br /> If you take that persentage, you will find the military is more educated than most jobs. ie A Auto Factory. Most don't have a grad 10. education. I know this, for my Brother in Law is a Forman at Ford in Oakville. He started at Ford 30 yrs ago, grad 11, no education, but big money. It took him 10 yrs to get a GED, and only reason he was able to become an Forman, was night school.<br /> There was a UN study done. It has operations in three scales. War fighting, Transitional Peacemaking, then peacekeeping. Most operations are Transitional, and peacekeeping. It was only the media that persented the WAR fighting in Afghanistan. I am not against peacekeeping,, when it is pratical. IE Bosnia, Cyprus. That is where there is two distinct armies. But in Afghanistan, Cambodia, Somalia, Haiti, etc. There is no visual army. It can be anyone. <br /> Canada has been in the Peacekeeping time frame. Canadians think, we walk around in Blue Berets, smiling and hunging everyone. Well Mr/Mrs. Canada it's not just that. It's you getting shot at, shelled, and dead.<br /> Maybe we should have a country like that, a country with no peace, no TV, no Timmies. Canadians are the only people that don't understand the real world. They are sanitzed. They have not seen bodies laying next to the road, and not been picked up. Because he's a Serb in Crotia, or a Muslim in a Hindu town. Canadians have not seen what people will do to each other because they are not like them. <br /> Well Fella I have, and the military is here to protect you, from people like that. <br /> No one is a Psycho. We do have some that get through but are released. So your calling my two daughters psycho? One is a RMS Clerk and one is a Supply tech. If you don't know what they are, I'll explain. A RMS Clerk is just a typists, court clerk, finance clerk. They deal with paper work. A spply tech is like working at any store, her job is to get materials to us. In the way of uniforms, food, ammo.<br /> So if their psycho, we better have all the people that work at Zellers jailed and the office workers in straight jackets.<br /> <br /> And you sound a lil psycho, Nukes? Now that is a warmonger and psycho. <br /> <br /> There is a news paper story from the states. I will post it. But here is the short version.<br /> <br /> A prof at a University in Cal was anti-military. He would go to Anti-War protests, etc.<br /> Well his son was in the WTC, on 911. Not only did he then support the military. He joined up as a National Guard Officer. And was served in Afghaistan and then Iraq. <br /> It said, it took, a personal lose. To have him understand the world as it is.

[Marcarc]

Buddy, if you got a degree in history it was in the days before writing because I can hardly understand a sentence you are putting together. "OOOO", that's a word? It's spelled "You're so tough" But thanks for helping me make my point. <br /> <br /> I was being somewhat facetious because there is so much jingoism out there that you can't even talk about the military without being dubbed a supporter of terrorism. And Canada wasn't even attacked. You can talk about ONE guy in California, or you can look at the hundreds of family members who formed an organization to argue against the war and find out their own government's complicity in 9/11. You can look at the dozens who started doing the talk show circuit to bring out american aggression overseas. The terrorists were SAUDIS, how many times do people need to be told that. Yet there were no attacks against Saudi Arabia. And of course we KNOW that the US had military designs on Afghanistan long before 9/11. <br /> <br /> So for protection let's straighten this out. There are no Haitians, Afghani's or Bosnians trying to kill me. You think NATO bombing the hell out of Bosnia helped? However, that wasn't the military's fault, that was Washington. Just about every general on staff said that air bombing would increase the carnage in Bosnia, and that's exactly what happened. But there were no bosnians trying to kill me, they didn't even know squat about Canada. The same WAS true of afghanis, but the more occupying we do overseas, the more likely it is that they WILL want to kill me. So what we are doing is not decreasing terrorism, but increasing its likelihood.<br /> <br /> Nobody blames military for political decisions. It was ironic to see the press cover that soldiers funeral and stated his reasons for going to Afghanistan. They didn't even provide a quote or anything, they just said "he went so he could make a difference". Of course the reality is that he went for the same reason a soldier does anything-he was TOLD to. My cousin in the military doesn't support what is being done in Afghanistan, but there is simply nothing he can do about it. Next september he ships out for a cause he has no faith in whatsoever. There is quite a difference between the 18-24 year old who wants excitement in his life and will go fight anywhere, anytime, and the thirtysomething with a wife and kids at home. <br /> <br /> But this thread is about military spending, not the structure and function of the military. And as the threads before show, Canada is well on par with most of the country's of the world. Canada is a member of the G-8, so what? So is Italy for pete's sake. Spain has a larger economy than Italy does, they also have more significant internal political problems and yet their military spending is less than ours. <br /> <br /> <br /> <br />

[Armyguy]

[QUOTE BY= Marcarc] Buddy, if you got a degree in history it was in the days before writing because I can hardly understand a sentence you are putting together. "OOOO", that's a word? It's spelled "You're so tough" But thanks for helping me make my point. <br /> <br /> I was being somewhat facetious because there is so much jingoism out there that you can't even talk about the military without being dubbed a supporter of terrorism. And Canada wasn't even attacked. You can talk about ONE guy in California, or you can look at the hundreds of family members who formed an organization to argue against the war and find out their own government's complicity in 9/11. You can look at the dozens who started doing the talk show circuit to bring out american aggression overseas. The terrorists were SAUDIS, how many times do people need to be told that. Yet there were no attacks against Saudi Arabia. And of course we KNOW that the US had military designs on Afghanistan long before 9/11. <br /> <br /> So for protection let's straighten this out. There are no Haitians, Afghani's or Bosnians trying to kill me. You think NATO bombing the hell out of Bosnia helped? However, that wasn't the military's fault, that was Washington. Just about every general on staff said that air bombing would increase the carnage in Bosnia, and that's exactly what happened. But there were no bosnians trying to kill me, they didn't even know squat about Canada. The same WAS true of afghanis, but the more occupying we do overseas, the more likely it is that they WILL want to kill me. So what we are doing is not decreasing terrorism, but increasing its likelihood.<br /> <br /> Nobody blames military for political decisions. It was ironic to see the press cover that soldiers funeral and stated his reasons for going to Afghanistan. They didn't even provide a quote or anything, they just said "he went so he could make a difference". Of course the reality is that he went for the same reason a soldier does anything-he was TOLD to. My cousin in the military doesn't support what is being done in Afghanistan, but there is simply nothing he can do about it. Next september he ships out for a cause he has no faith in whatsoever. There is quite a difference between the 18-24 year old who wants excitement in his life and will go fight anywhere, anytime, and the thirtysomething with a wife and kids at home. <br /> <br /> But this thread is about military spending, not the structure and function of the military. And as the threads before show, Canada is well on par with most of the country's of the world. Canada is a member of the G-8, so what? So is Italy for pete's sake. Spain has a larger economy than Italy does, they also have more significant internal political problems and yet their military spending is less than ours. <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> If your cousin doesn't believe in it why is he going? FOR THE MONEY. He can ask not to go. You don't have to go if you don't want to. I have had 2 soldiers ask and they are not going. I like to have his name. He can join the rest of the unemployed.<br /> As for the spelling OOO sorry. For spell check. <br /> Dick head.

[Dr Caleb]

Gentlemen. Do not make Hulk angry.<br /> <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/evil.gif' alt='Evil'> <br /> <br /> Let's refrain from the namecalling, shall we?<br />

[Armageddon]

[QUOTE BY= badsector]<br /> We don't need to spend any more on our military. The army is a special interest group, it lobbies for more money on the expense of others.<br /> <br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> That's practically all agencies and departments in the government that want money.<br /> I think you still don't get it. Our military is not given enough funds to be an updated force. Like I mentioned, our jets are crashing, our Sea Kings are aging, and we don't even have long-range heavy air transport.<br /> So yes, the military does need more funds. Canada can support such necessary increases, considering we only spend 1.1% of our GDP on it.<br />

[Perturbed]

[QUOTE BY= Marcarc] It depends what you mean by 'protection'. The reality is that for protection against invasion, you don't need soldiers at all, all you need is a deterrent, like some nuclear warheads with targeting capabilities. THat's science, research and production. Against 'terrorism', again, that's far easier-stop terrorizing other countries. <br /> <br /> The only 'terrorist activity' that resulted in violence since the 50's came during the 70's from the FLQ. Ironic that they spent so much time and effort to run the communist party out, and violence comes from irate Quebecers. Anybody who thinks Quebec didn't have very legitimate grievances doesn't know much about Quebec. Terrorism from disenfranchised parties comes for a reason, usually because people are tired of getting screwed over.<br /> <br /> Personally, I think the MILITARY are the welfare bums. These people for the most part are either psychos who want to kill people, or too stupid to get through university-I"ve known lots of both and our military friend, if he IS military, certainly portrays the irony of having bigoted and ignorant people engaged in 'peacekeeping'. It's no surprise that something like Somalia happened before, and would again. The difference is no doubt the military has learned what is necessary to make sure people don't find out about it.<br /> <br /> I've got a cousin who's been in the military for ten years, he couldn't even get through the bird courses at one of the dumbest universities in the country. Now he has a butthead job in the milatary, and after ten years he earns more than most PHD research scientists. <br /> <br /> Since we're sharing opinions, I'd have the MILITARY cleaning all that dogshit-hell, most of the time they aren't doing anything anyway. Pissing away money on endless training they could get with a video game.<br /> <br /> Oh yeah, a good percentage of those 'welfare moms' are single thanks to deadbeats in the military-go live in a military town and see.[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> <br /> Marcarc you really are making an ass out of yourself. The people in the military are human just like everyone else. Some are yahoos sure but many are more more family oriented than most. they have a much higher birth rate than most.<br /> <br /> You are also completely dismissive of how hard people have to work and the type of training soldiers get, SOLDIERS not simply nukes being the basis of a deterrent.<br /> <br /> Canada may be worth defending but you certainly aren't.

[Diogenes]

[QUOTE BY= Dr Caleb] Gentlemen. Do not make Hulk angry.<br /> <br /> <br /> Let's refrain from the namecalling, shall we?<br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> so much for d Caleb's admonishment <br /> making an ass of one's self - 'has strong traditional root here and been done by many, it cuts through the majority of posters from the mods to the ranks <br /> Nice to see you carry on the tradition <br /> If you want to play moderator - go sfter armygay, guy <br /> woops! I really meant guy, honest!

[Armyguy]

[QUOTE BY= Diogenes] [QUOTE BY= Dr Caleb] Gentlemen. Do not make Hulk angry.<br /> <br /> <br /> Let's refrain from the namecalling, shall we?<br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> so much for d Caleb's admonishment <br /> making an ass of one's self - 'has strong traditional root here and been done by many, it cuts through the majority of posters from the mods to the ranks <br /> Nice to see you carry on the tradition <br /> If you want to play moderator - go sfter armygay, guy <br /> woops! I really meant guy, honest! [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Dio <br /> In most of your posts, you always note gay. How would you know fella, Kiss Kiss. <br /> As for Marc, you still have not answered my question? What do you do? What knowledge of Afghanistan do you have? That goes for you too Dio? Maybe Macleans?, Time? CTV? no CBC the Commie channel?

[Diogenes]

[QUOTE BY= Armyguy] [QUOTE BY= Diogenes] [QUOTE BY= Dr Caleb] Gentlemen. Do not make Hulk angry.<br /> <br /> <br /> Let's refrain from the namecalling, shall we?<br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> so much for d Caleb's admonishment <br /> making an ass of one's self - 'has strong traditional root here and been done by many, it cuts through the majority of posters from the mods to the ranks <br /> Nice to see you carry on the tradition <br /> If you want to play moderator - go sfter armygay, guy <br /> woops! I really meant guy, honest! [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Dio <br /> In most of your posts, you always note gay. How would you know fella, Kiss Kiss. <br /> As for Marc, you still have not answered my question? What do you do? What knowledge of Afghanistan do you have? That goes for you too Dio? Maybe Macleans?, Time? CTV? no CBC the Commie channel?[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> support your claim with evidence armyguy or be the fool you present yourself here to be<br /> Who Is you Commanding Officer?<br /> and is he aware of how you represent the military?

[Perturbed]

[QUOTE]Maybe we should have a country like that, a country with no peace, no TV, no Timmies. Canadians are the only people that don't understand the real world. They are sanitzed.[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> I blame 50 years of egalitarianism, prosperity and multiculturalism.<br /> <br /> [QUOTE]They have not seen bodies laying next to the road, and not been picked up. Because he's a Serb in Crotia, or a Muslim in a Hindu town. Canadians have not seen what people will do to each other because they are not like them.[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Ever been to Toronto or Vancouver Armyguy??? Perhaps some day we will learn what people will do to each other as these cities and Montreal are more diverse than the Balkans. Only Canada's civil culture prevents a bloodbath which is beginning to happen in Europe. Any thoughts?<br /> <br /> <br /> <br />

[Perturbed]

[QUOTE BY= Marcarc] Buddy, if you got a degree in history it was in the days before writing because I can hardly understand a sentence you are putting together. "OOOO", that's a word? It's spelled "You're so tough" But thanks for helping me make my point. <br /> <br /> I was being somewhat facetious because there is so much jingoism out there that you can't even talk about the military without being dubbed a supporter of terrorism. And Canada wasn't even attacked. You can talk about ONE guy in California, or you can look at the hundreds of family members who formed an organization to argue against the war and find out their own government's complicity in 9/11. You can look at the dozens who started doing the talk show circuit to bring out american aggression overseas. The terrorists were SAUDIS, how many times do people need to be told that. Yet there were no attacks against Saudi Arabia. And of course we KNOW that the US had military designs on Afghanistan long before 9/11. <br /> <br /> So for protection let's straighten this out. There are no Haitians, Afghani's or Bosnians trying to kill me. You think NATO bombing the hell out of Bosnia helped? However, that wasn't the military's fault, that was Washington. Just about every general on staff said that air bombing would increase the carnage in Bosnia, and that's exactly what happened. But there were no bosnians trying to kill me, they didn't even know squat about Canada. The same WAS true of afghanis, but the more occupying we do overseas, the more likely it is that they WILL want to kill me. So what we are doing is not decreasing terrorism, but increasing its likelihood.<br /> <br /> Nobody blames military for political decisions. It was ironic to see the press cover that soldiers funeral and stated his reasons for going to Afghanistan. They didn't even provide a quote or anything, they just said "he went so he could make a difference". Of course the reality is that he went for the same reason a soldier does anything-he was TOLD to. My cousin in the military doesn't support what is being done in Afghanistan, but there is simply nothing he can do about it. Next september he ships out for a cause he has no faith in whatsoever. There is quite a difference between the 18-24 year old who wants excitement in his life and will go fight anywhere, anytime, and the thirtysomething with a wife and kids at home. <br /> <br /> But this thread is about military spending, not the structure and function of the military. And as the threads before show, Canada is well on par with most of the country's of the world. Canada is a member of the G-8, so what? So is Italy for pete's sake. Spain has a larger economy than Italy does, they also have more significant internal political problems and yet their military spending is less than ours. <br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> 1 - Saudi Arabia could some day be targeted, yet they have close relations with the Bush family (read The Bush Saudi Connection) so it won't happen during this presidency.<br /> <br /> 2 - The bombing campaign in Kosovo in 1999 was due to exaggerated claims that Slobodan Milosevic was killing thousands of people....NATO is obsesses with the liberal notion of multi-ethnic states and Milosevic wanted to prevent that from happening. He wanted a state for the Serbs....CIA backed Muslim warlords are presently killing Serbs as we speak.<br /> <br /> As for Bosnia I assume you were referring to the bombing campaign in 1998?<br /> <br /> 3 - Technically Marcarc the Canadian soldier killed recently was only 22 yet he did have a wife and already had one kid, which will obviously now be his last. I'd be more sensitive--especially with Dr. Caleb ready to jam you posting mechanism. <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/wink.gif' alt='Wink'>

[Armyguy]

[QUOTE BY= Diogenes] [QUOTE BY= Armyguy] [QUOTE BY= Diogenes] [QUOTE BY= Dr Caleb] Gentlemen. Do not make Hulk angry.<br /> <br /> <br /> Let's refrain from the namecalling, shall we?<br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> so much for d Caleb's admonishment <br /> making an ass of one's self - 'has strong traditional root here and been done by many, it cuts through the majority of posters from the mods to the ranks <br /> Nice to see you carry on the tradition <br /> If you want to play moderator - go sfter armygay, guy <br /> woops! I really meant guy, honest! [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Dio <br /> In most of your posts, you always note gay. How would you know fella, Kiss Kiss. <br /> As for Marc, you still have not answered my question? What do you do? What knowledge of Afghanistan do you have? That goes for you too Dio? Maybe Macleans?, Time? CTV? no CBC the Commie channel?[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> support your claim with evidence armyguy or be the fool you present yourself here to be<br /> Who Is you Commanding Officer?<br /> and is he aware of how you represent the military? [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> For one I am a Warrant Officer. I have served 27 loyal yrs as a soldier, with 9 UN/NATO tours. UNFORCYP, UNISOM,UNPROFOR x2,IFOR,KFOR, SFORx2,ISAF. <br /> I and many others have the same view about our present Tour. The NDP are off the wall with the debate. Why, they have no clue about what we are doing. They are the most Anti Military group we have. They rather shut us down and have us on welfare. I would be happy to just sit around and drink beer and have them and you pay me for doing nothing. <br /> And I'll ask again, where do you people get your info? My daughter and I have been there, so who would know better? Some reporter who has not or us? I will also ask, what do, you and Marcco do? What knowledge do you have to retort my statements. <br />

[Perturbed]

[QUOTE BY= Armyguy] [QUOTE BY= Diogenes] [QUOTE BY= Armyguy] [QUOTE BY= Diogenes] [QUOTE BY= Dr Caleb] Gentlemen. Do not make Hulk angry.<br /> <br /> <br /> Let's refrain from the namecalling, shall we?<br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> so much for d Caleb's admonishment <br /> making an ass of one's self - 'has strong traditional root here and been done by many, it cuts through the majority of posters from the mods to the ranks <br /> Nice to see you carry on the tradition <br /> If you want to play moderator - go sfter armygay, guy <br /> woops! I really meant guy, honest! [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Dio <br /> In most of your posts, you always note gay. How would you know fella, Kiss Kiss. <br /> As for Marc, you still have not answered my question? What do you do? What knowledge of Afghanistan do you have? That goes for you too Dio? Maybe Macleans?, Time? CTV? no CBC the Commie channel?[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> support your claim with evidence armyguy or be the fool you present yourself here to be<br /> Who Is you Commanding Officer?<br /> and is he aware of how you represent the military? [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> For one I am a Warrant Officer. I have served 27 loyal yrs as a soldier, with 9 UN/NATO tours. UNFORCYP, UNISOM,UNPROFOR x2,IFOR,KFOR, SFORx2,ISAF. <br /> I and many others have the same view about our present Tour. The NDP are off the wall with the debate. Why, they have no clue about what we are doing. They are the most Anti Military group we have. They rather shut us down and have us on welfare. I would be happy to just sit around and drink beer and have them and you pay me for doing nothing. <br /> And I'll ask again, where do you people get your info? My daughter and I have been there, so who would know better? Some reporter who has not or us? I will also ask, what do, you and Marcco do? What knowledge do you have to retort my statements. <br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> <br /> 27 years? Wow, that's impressive.

[AntiFate]

Perturbed you little racist troll what do u have against China anyways? oh...... did some chinese guy beat u in life and stole ur wife or got a better job than you, or maybe ur working for a chinese boss.