[Angus McCracken]

As for Torontonians, I remember when I was living abroad. I was living and working with people who from London, Brisbane, Edinburgh, Calgary, Bordeaux, Liverpool. And for some reason I was always considered to be from Toronto. My reply was that I'm wasn't from Toronto, I was from Canada. Of course they didn't get it.

I don't know maybe it's something that's in the water in southern Ontario. My experience has always been that when ever the subject of Toronto came up, people from "the rest" of Ontario always sigh and role their eyes. Torontonians live in a different world compared to the rest of Canadians. I like to refer to Toronto as being a "bubble".

Montreal is a word class city. Vancouver is a world class city. So is Toronto, but it seems less Canadian, and more American compared to either Montreal or Vancouver. And there's never anything to do in Toronto, unless you want to pay a small fortune and see the Leafs play.

Torontonians are patriotic, it's just that their city and its citizen's points of view are different compared to the rest of the country. Gay marriage may be an important issue to some in Toronto, but it's not in other areas of Canada. Priorities are different compared to the rest of the country.

Toronto sums up the rest of the country ironically. They think they're the best in the world, but they're not and while the city used to be a nice English Canadian city, it now imitates an American city. Montreal is the best example of Canada; it's English and French, officially bilingual and multicultural, and it's cultural reputation is known worldwide. You know I'd gladly give the Separatists Toronto for Montreal any day.

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"I pick the bones of what's been done. I'm the revolution when the door is shut. I bite the hand that slaps me senseless. I am far too Canadian" -SotW

[Spud]

I do not hate myself and I am not foaming at the mouth.

[Perturbed]

Sorry Spud, but I can't let you get away with this:

"Montreal is a world class city. Vancouver is a world class city. So is Toronto, but it seems less Canadian, and more American compared to either Montreal or Vancouver."


I would agree with this 10 or 20 years ago, but Torontonians are much more patriotic than they were a few years ago. When it comes to architecture, YES, we have been Americanized.

Montreal lost its business community, has equally bad infrastructure and is known for their partying.

Vancouver is known for drug addiction, marijuana grow-ops and even less to do. Vancouverites tell me Toronto is a hopping place compared to Toronto.


"And there's never anything to do in Toronto, unless you want to pay a small fortune and see the Leafs play."

Unless you have a brain with interests and want to join one of the thousands of clubs, volunteer-groups, athletic groups, read at one of the dozens of libraries, go to minor hockey games, CFL games where the oldest team in North America (the Toronto Argonauts) play football. MLB and NBA games for well under under 20 dollars, not that they are Canadian.

Unless you want to eat in the largest number of some of Canada's best restaurants.


"Torontonians are patriotic, it's just that their city and its citizen's points of view are different compared to the rest of the country. Gay marriage may be an important issue to some in Toronto, but it's not in other areas of Canada. Priorities are different compared to the rest of the country."

Well, it is a big city, but you've made so many assumptions and generalizations that I don't understand what you are saying. Gays in a city are a sign of other types of success, according to research. They are an "indicator". This being said, gay people I know care little about gay marriage. How can you pigeon-hole the opinions of 4 million people?


"Toronto sums up the rest of the country ironically. They think they're the best in the world, but they're not and while the city used to be a nice English Canadian city, it now imitates an American city. Montreal is the best example of Canada; it's English and French, officially bilingual and multicultural, and it's cultural reputation is known worldwide. You know I'd gladly give the Separatists Toronto for Montreal any day."


I agree that Montreal is better culturally, but don't tell us what Torontonians think. A lot of Torontonians are keeping quiet about their contempt for the society they live in.

As for Montreal being great, they are good, but they aren't Toronto.

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The midget, Bush, and that Rumsfield deserve only to be beaten with shoes by freedom loving people everywhere.

- Mohammed Saeed al-Sahhaf, The Iraqi Informat

[Angus McCracken]

It's was McCracken and not Spud who posted that! I'm not going to get drawn into and arguement with you about Toronto, frankly I'd rather watch my toenails grown than talk about Toronto. Yes, a lot of what you wrote about in regards to "things to do in T.O." is true, but a lot of what you wrote can be done in other cities, including Vancouver and Montreal.

I could bring up a 'ditry list' of what Toronto is known for just as you brought up the 'dirty lists' of Vancouver and Montreal. You know as well as I do that Toronto is far from innocent.

And oh please! Don't even try and defend the "we're the greatest city in the world" mentality. There are too many people in the city of Toronto who actually believe Toronto is the best city in the world, which is nonsense (I personally prefer Hong Kong to Toronto, but I don't believe there is a 'greatest city in the world').

I go on experience with Toronto, I have family there and since I'm from southern Ontario I have to go to Toronto often. You're right it's wrong of me to generalise, I misused the gay marriage example (oddly enough I was going on experience dealing with a gay family member from Toronto). Still, there are again too many people in Toronto who look down with contempt on other Canadians, particularly those people from the west.

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"I pick the bones of what's been done. I'm the revolution when the door is shut. I bite the hand that slaps me senseless. I am far too Canadian" -SotW

[Perturbed]

You sound bitter about something.


Anyway, just found out we're getting another TTC strike. That means no service, not even out underfunded, overpriced subway. None at all! It requires a 2 cent fare increase to pay for a 3% salary hike. We just got a 25 CENT increase, but they still can't afford to pay the workers a raise. That's how underfunded Toronto is.

Recently, a mainstream media source, the Metro Today free paper that is handed out on the subway, published a psychologist's study on Toronto.

He found that Torontonians feel hated by the rest of Canada, and that Toronto had the lowest morale of any city in Canada.

Here were the two reasons given for the low morale in the story:

1 - large number of immigrants (sound familiar)

2 - wealth inequality. (which multiculturalism simply exacerbates)




---
The midget, Bush, and that Rumsfield deserve only to be beaten with shoes by freedom loving people everywhere.

- Mohammed Saeed al-Sahhaf, The Iraqi Informat

[Dave Ruston]

Nothing to do in Toronto? Ontario Science Centre, Art Gallery of Ontario, Hockey Hall of Fame, Ontario Place, Toronto Zoo,CN Tower, etc. Sure, Toronto has changed alot in the last 20 years, but I think it`s still a cool city! Sure, some of the people in Toronto think they`re 'it' (relatives of mine included) but I will always have a place in my heart for the city in which I was born.

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Dave Ruston