[Deacon]

Nice attempt at a dodge.

In case you didn't actually understand my post, I said even 6,000 was a discgrace.

Even 1 is too many come to think of it.

Tell you what, you can play your numbers game all you want. Hope it makes you feel better.

My point is about the value of human life, your point is merely a fixation on numbers.

Funny I don't recall "picking on the Germans", but they are responsible for the deaths of the hebrews in question, reagardless of number.

Maybe that's because Germany started that little party called World War II.

Maybe it's because Hitler's big plan was called the "Final Solution".

Maybe it's because it was the attempted genocide of an "inferior race".

Maybe it's because the concentration camps were purposely designed and built human extermination plants whose sole reason for being was the timely liquidation of as many people as possible in the shortest span of time. All of the victims obviously sub-human and not deserving life.

Don't you agree?

You might actually want to read Mein Kampf, you may learn sonething.

Or is Mein Kampf just more Zionist propaganda?

[h.f. wolff]

Deacon wrote:

"Even 1 is too many come to think of it."

There goes your intellectual honesty. Why don't you try and sell that to the zionists? They'd laugh at you and toss you into the looney bin.

The reason the zionists picked 6m in '52 was because it was a horrific number; further, 6m is a mystical number from the tora. And they knew full well that if they talked about verifyable numbers, which today stand between 60,000 and 600,000 from all causes, nobody would have given them the time of day over it for the black mail of Germany.

Oh yeah, the Auschwitz camp commander had it beaten out of him, too, during the Nuernberg Cangeroo trials. I suppose you'd call that Justice, wot?

It all boils down to this: If the Hollywood Tale Of The Holocaust were fact then those that argue against it (who, by the way, are the ONLY people willing to discuss facts) would not have to be persecuted and tossed in jail. Print the pro- and con-side facts side-by-side in the paper and let the public sort it out. Or have a debate on TV.

Don't you wonder, at least a little, why this hasn't been done?

For starters you could read the transcripts of the Zuendel trials of the mid '80. It's these that got me going on this subject when my son brought home a copy from his High School library.

Then you could follow up with the trial of "Ivan the Terrible" in Israel, and why the Israeli Supreme Court tossed out ALL eye witness testimony.

20m to 30m Christians were murdered in the Soviet Union and no one raised an eyebrow. 60m to 80m Chinese were murdered in China and the world goes on without a hiccup. Ditto ad infinitum. Fact is you and your ilk don't care tuppence about human life. You have no intellectual honesty, no courage, no spine. Just endless bleatings about the "Hollywood Tales OF The Holocaust".

The concentration camps in Germany were fully justified; after all, Judea declared war on Germany in 1933. (London Times headline). Consequently Germany placed suspicious individuals into concentration camps the way Canada, USA, and England did.

Google on "London Cage" and see what you get.

Germany had legitimate reasons to invade Poland to protect its nationals.

England, France, USA in fact, declared war on Germany. For what reason????? To keep Poland free? Then why permit the Soviet Union, an ally of the "free world" to occupy Poland?

Can't you see the hypocrisy in all this?

H.F. Wolff

[Deacon]

"There goes your intellectual honesty. Why don't you try and sell that to the zionists? They'd laugh at you and toss you into the looney bin."

So... 1 murder based on ethic standards is acceptable, but millions are not?

You're a nutter, plain and simple.

By the way, have you ever read Mein Kampf?

"The concentration camps in Germany were fully justified; after all, Judea declared war on Germany in 1933. (London Times headline). Consequently Germany placed suspicious individuals into concentration camps the way Canada, USA, and England did."

Oh yeah, next time I'm in Yorkshire I'll visit the gas chambers and crematoria.

[Deacon]

By the way, have you ever read Mein Kampf?

Answer the question yes or no.

[h.f. wolff]

Deacon said:
"You're a nutter, plain and simple."

Name calling is the final refuge of the out-argued scoundrel.

"Oh yeah, next time I'm in Yorkshire I'll visit the gas chambers and crematoria."

Such a profound response to factual statements proves the observation that the pro Holocausters cannot present one verifiable observation to any debate, but must resort to name calling and other personal attacks.

I rest my case.

H.F. Wolff

[Deacon]

You have no case.

And btw, answe my question:

have you ever read Mein Kampf?

and a folow up:

if yes, do you agree with what Hitler said?

Yes or no?

Answer my question.

[Deacon]

And no matter what verbal games you try, you're not getting away until you answer my questions.

What are you afraid of, just a couple of simple yes or now questions?

Odd, your silence on these isn't it?

[Deacon]

Oh, and seeing as mein Kampf was first published in 1925, it seems obvious to anyone with a brain that Hitler declared his war on the Jews at least 8 years before "Judea declared war" on his government in Germany.

Do the math, if you can.

And also answer my previous questions concerning your reading of mein Kampf and whether or not you agree with what Hitler said.

Yes or no answers.

[Dr Caleb]

"Out argued scoundrel" indeed.

We both see, he's just trying to deflect the issues toward non-sequitrs. You won't get such a definite answer out of him. I've seen him post here before, sometimes with the obvious 'white power' rhetoric.

The meat of his argument is that 'numbers can't be proven', but we all know the Nazi's didn't conduct a census on their victims.

---
"I think it's important to always carry enough technology to restart civilization, should it be necessary." Mark Tilden

[Deacon]

True enough DC

And I fully intend to rub his nose in those questions until Hell freezes over.

Btw H.F. Wolff, I put forward the following:

You are a racist. Period.

Your refusal to answer yes or no to my valid questions concerning Mein Kampf betrays your anit-semetic bias.

But, in the interests of fairness I will put forward my two questions one more time:

1) have you ever read mein Kampf?

2) do you agree with what Hitler said in Mein Kampf?

Yes or No?

I submit you're too much the intellectual coward to do so, because either way you're screwed.

Game. Set. Match.

[h.f. wolff]

Dr? Caleb said:

"The meat of his argument is that 'numbers can't be proven', but we all know the Nazi's didn't conduct a census on their victims."

The National Socialists in Germany kept very good records indeed. The concentration camp death books fell into the hands of the soviets who didn't release them until after the collapse of the Soviet Union. I wonder why?

The Reichsbahn in Germany has excellent records also, because they got paid for every person they transported.

Further, the International Red Cross has records of its inspections and observations, and not once was anything reported about mass destruction of persons.

I suppose it is too much of a strain for you two worthies to take the time to check out the records I have mentioned several times.

Afraid it might upset the apple cart of your pre-conceived opinions?

Whether I have read Mein Kampf, and what I think of Hitler, is totally irrelevant to the questions at hand: That Germany and the Germans have been demonized for actions which have been blown out of all proportion for purposes of black mail, and which fall into total insignificance when compared to the actions of the "free world" and others, over the last 100 years or so.

I am a little surprised that you two are so unreceptive to the arguments I present. But then "My mind is made up don't confuse me with facts" is the intellectually lazy persons standard response.

H.F. Wolff

[h.f. wolff]

Deacon said:

"You are a racist. Period."

Ah, yes. The name calling again! The last refuge of the out-argued.....!

"Your refusal to answer yes or no to my valid questions concerning Mein Kampf betrays your anit-semetic bias."

I'm not here to answer questions, one of my pleasures in life is to poke holes and disclose the idiocy in the Hollywood Tales Of The Holocaust.

You two are obviously mathematically challenged such that I am forced to conclude your field of study was basketweaving or the like. Having trouble reading, too?

What never ceases to amaze me is how people are so set against any Minimizing of the Number of Victims of the Tales Of The Holocaust.

Let me explain: When 9/11 occured the initial estimate of number of victims was in the area of 50,000 or so. Gradually the number was decreased until finally a tally was agreed upon of just under 3,000. Everybody was happy that this final figure was so much lower than originally feared.

But examine the Holocaust? Noooooo! Its 6m! Its gotta be 6m! Nothing else but 6m will do! What will we do without our 6m? Even when the "official" tally says otherwise, its 6m.
The world will come to an end if it isn't 6m. Better jail everybody that questions the holy 6m.

I'm afraid the intellectual coward is YOU! You are unwilling to answer the question you yourself have posed: 500 m people have perished, why not punish those responsible, instead of persecuting only Germany which is BLAMED for 3.5m of them; ie. 0.7 % of the total. There wouldn't be any ulterior motive for this sort of distorted response, would there? Nothing so crass as filthy lucre? Like 100 billion dollars worth???

If questions like these do not at least raise some curiosity in your underworked minds then the only conclusion possible is that you make your living off the Shoah business and you are profiteers off the Holocaust, ie. the misery of others. This would, of course, explain why it is in your interest to keep the # at 6m.

H.F. Wolff

[Deacon]

Answer the damn questions posed.

Have you ever read Mein Kampf?

Do you agree with what Hitler said?

Yes or No.

[Deacon]

You answer mine and I'll answer yours.

You first.

[Dr Caleb]

"Ah, yes. The name calling again! The last refuge of the out-argued.....!"<br />
<br />
"Dr? Caleb said:"<br />
<br />
Apparently your own hippocracy is lost on you. Not my problem if you failed english.<br />
<br />
"I'm not here to answer questions, "<br />
<br />
Well, the response is obvious. Go away.<br />
<br />
"instead of persecuting only Germany which is BLAMED for 3.5m of them"<br />
<br />
See, this is how we know you're a troll. No one here blamed Germany for anything. Unless in your mind, all Germans are somehow Nazis.<br />
<br />
"If questions like these do not at least raise some curiosity in your underworked minds then the only conclusion possible is that you make your living off the Shoah business and you are profiteers off the Holocaust, ie. the misery of others."<br />
<br />
And another troll in the form of Non-Sequitr.<br />
<br />
"This would, of course, explain why it is in your interest to keep the # at 6m."<br />
<br />
No, the number 6 million is only rough, but more or less accurate. My links show your number, 3.5m, can be verified in Poland alone. That would be accurate, if there were only death camps in Poland. As Deacon poined out, the number really doesn't matter. It's the magnitude of the horror that does.<br />
<br />
You point to the Nazi records captured by the Soviets, but neglect to add the additional records captured recently (1970's) by the British, that clearly support the number 6 million.<br />
<br />
"Further, the International Red Cross has records of its inspections and observations, and not once was anything reported about mass destruction of persons."<br />
<br />
Logical fallicy: Argument from Authority. The IRC was given access to the POW camps, not death camps. One cannot report on something one did not observe. The allies knew about the death camps in 1944 at least, but through third hand knowledge. <br />
<br />
<a href="http://www.scrapbookpages.com/CzechRepublic/Theresienstadt/TheresienstadtGhetto/History/RedCrossVisit.html">http://www.scrapbookpages.com/CzechRepublic/Theresienstadt/TheresienstadtGhetto/History/RedCrossVisit.html</a><br />
<br />
"One major obstacle was that the Nazi-controlled German Red Cross refused to cooperate with the Geneva statutes including blatant violations such as the deportation of Jews from Germany and the mass murders conducted in the concentration camps run by the German government. Moreover, two other main aggressors, the Soviet Union and Japan, were not party to the 1929 Geneva Conventions and were not legally required to follow the rules of the conventions. Thus, other countries were not bound to follow the Conventions regarding their prisoners in return."<br />
<br />
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Cross#The_ICRC_and_World_War_Two">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Cross#The_ICRC_and_World_War_Two</a><p>---<br>"I think it's important to always carry enough technology to restart civilization, should it be necessary." Mark Tilden<br />